Re: [MeeGo-dev] Debian Mobile -- Debian GNU/Linux for mobile devices

[Nikita V. Youshchenko]

> > Am Mittwoch, den 17.02.2010, 17:20 +0100 schrieb Raphael Hertzog:
> > > On Wed, 17 Feb 2010, Julian Andres Klode wrote:
> > > > Is anyone interested in starting a Debian Mobile project, probably
> > > > as a Debian Pure Blend?
>
> Count me in.

Me too.


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Re: [MeeGo-dev] Debian Mobile -- Debian GNU/Linux for mobile devices

[Nikita V. Youshchenko]

> > Of course work should happen upstream as most as possible. But as
> > upstream will use rpm, our part is repackaging.
>
> It should be possible to work in the manner you have proposed without
> problems. I am a great believer in the power of the community to resolve
> any potential issues which might come along.
>
> f I understand this right, the MeeGo tree + Debian Flavouring (DFSG) ?

Still would be good to provide binary-compatibility with original, to keep 
it possible to install non-free stuff (maps/routing, skype, etc).


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Re: Debian Mobile -- Debian GNU/Linux for mobile devices

[Andreas Marschke]

> Hi,
> 
> Is anyone interested in starting a Debian Mobile project, probably as a
> Debian Pure Blend?
> 
> Goals:
>   - Provide an environment for handheld and netbook devices
> + example: the Nokia N900
>   - Provide a Debian-based implementation of MeeGo
> + Packaging the software from MeeGo
> 
> Regards,
> Julian
> 
> (Please CC me in your replies)
> 

Hi Julain,

FYI: There is also the hackable:1 Distribution which is debian/em-debian based 
and funded by Bearstech in France(I think). It runs on my Openmoko and is 
really nice and stable. I think it can run on other mobilephones aswell. 

See http://www.hackable1.org  for more information.

Cheers,

Andreas Marschke


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Bug#570367: ITP: liblocale-ruby -- pure ruby locale library

[Tatsuki Sugiura]

Package: wnpp
Severity: wishlist
Owner: Tatsuki Sugiura 


* Package name: liblocale-ruby
  Version :  2.0.5
 Upstream Author  : Masao Mutoh 
* URL : http://rubyforge.org/projects/locale/
* License :  GPL or Ruby's
  Programming Lang: ruby
  Description : pure ruby locale library



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Re: Debian Mobile -- Debian GNU/Linux for mobile devices

[Gergely Fazekas]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1



Julian Andres Klode wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> Is anyone interested in starting a Debian Mobile project, probably as a
> Debian Pure Blend?
> 
> Goals:
>   - Provide an environment for handheld and netbook devices
> + example: the Nokia N900
>   - Provide a Debian-based implementation of MeeGo
> + Packaging the software from MeeGo
> 
> Regards,
> Julian
> 
> (Please CC me in your replies)

Count me in too, it's an interesting project!

Greg
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=e6wV
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Re: Status of systemtap in Debian

[Lucas Nussbaum]

On 18/02/10 at 00:18 +0100, Frank Lin PIAT wrote:
> On Tue, 2010-02-16 at 22:47 +0100, Lucas Nussbaum wrote:
> > On 16/02/10 at 22:27 +0100, Bastian Blank wrote:
> > > On Tue, Feb 16, 2010 at 09:13:06PM +0100, Lucas Nussbaum wrote:
> > > > - disk space on buildds: at least 2 GiB are required to build a kernel
> > > >   with debuginfo. (that doesn't sound too hard to satisfy)
> > > 
> > > A typical build includes between 2 and 10 of them.
> > 
> > Ah, I missed that. Provided the build of the different are sequential,
> > the tree is not cleaned up between builds?
> > 
> > So that means at most 20 GiB, which probably excludes more buildds.
> > 
> > > > - mirror space: each debug .deb would use ~ 450 MB (see
> > > >   http://ddebs.ubuntu.com/pool/main/l/linux/)
> > > 
> > > Our archive does not support ddebs.
> > 
> > Why couldn't it be done using a normal deb?
> 
> Noob question...
> 
> Aren't there some alternatives so people don't have to download all the
> MegaBytes ? (iSCSI ; DRDB ; FUSE/HTTP... whatever)
> Especially for fast moving targets, like unstable.

I's only a few hundreds of megabytes per kernel image. Some games or
debug packages require more space than that. I don't think it's worth
deploying an infrastructure just for that.
-- 
| Lucas Nussbaum
| lu...@lucas-nussbaum.net   http://www.lucas-nussbaum.net/ |
| jabber: lu...@nussbaum.fr GPG: 1024D/023B3F4F |


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Re: Status of systemtap in Debian

[Bastian Blank]

On Thu, Feb 18, 2010 at 02:01:19PM +0100, Lucas Nussbaum wrote:
> On 18/02/10 at 00:18 +0100, Frank Lin PIAT wrote:
> > On Tue, 2010-02-16 at 22:47 +0100, Lucas Nussbaum wrote:
> > > Why couldn't it be done using a normal deb?

It is just a matter of taste.

> I's only a few hundreds of megabytes per kernel image.

Its around half a GiB per image.

>Some games or
> debug packages require more space than that. I don't think it's worth
> deploying an infrastructure just for that.

Did you actually check that? In unstable I found 2 packages larger than
500MiB and less then 10 over 200MiB. None of them is contains debugging
information. And for the data packages there is something planned.

Bastian

-- 
I'm a soldier, not a diplomat.  I can only tell the truth.
-- Kirk, "Errand of Mercy", stardate 3198.9


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Re: Status of systemtap in Debian

[Lucas Nussbaum]

On 18/02/10 at 14:31 +0100, Bastian Blank wrote:
> > I's only a few hundreds of megabytes per kernel image.
> 
> Its around half a GiB per image.

Isn't that a correct instance of "a few hundreds of megabytes"? :)

> >Some games or
> > debug packages require more space than that. I don't think it's worth
> > deploying an infrastructure just for that.
> 
> Did you actually check that? In unstable I found 2 packages larger than
> 500MiB and less then 10 over 200MiB. None of them is contains debugging
> information.

Someone else did on IRC, but apparently he computed the aggregate size
per source package, which isn't the same thing.
openjdk-6-dbg uses 170 MB according to the Packages file.
libqt4-webkit-dbg uses from 134 MB to 142 MB per arch.
libwebkit-1.0-2-dbg also ranges from 122 MB to 128 MB per arch.

So, yes, the kernel debuginfo would be bigger, but:
1/ we are not talking about adding it for every arch
2/ it might be of interest to quite a lot of people to have that data.

> And for the data packages there is something planned.

Sure. However, it doesn't cost much to use normal .debs now, and switch
to ddebs or a separate archive later, when it's ready.
-- 
| Lucas Nussbaum
| lu...@lucas-nussbaum.net   http://www.lucas-nussbaum.net/ |
| jabber: lu...@nussbaum.fr GPG: 1024D/023B3F4F |


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Re: Status of systemtap in Debian

[Troy Heber]

On 02/16/10 13:54, dann frazier wrote:
> 
> The kernel team discussed this at our face to face meeting (due to
> some prompting from the 'crash' maintainer). 

I didn't see this explicitly mentioned in the rest of the discussion,
but debug kernel images are useful for more than just systemtap. It
would make it much easier for our users to enable kdump in order to
get kernel crash dumps. It would also let users run the crash debugger
on the live system.

Troy


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Re: Debian Mobile -- Debian GNU/Linux for mobile devices

[Nikita V. Youshchenko]

> Hi,
>
> Is anyone interested in starting a Debian Mobile project, probably as a
> Debian Pure Blend?
>
> Goals:
>   - Provide an environment for handheld and netbook devices
> + example: the Nokia N900

Interestingly,

is it possible to create a mix between current n900 packages and debian, 
such that resulting system will look and work more or less similar to 
current n900 "firmware" (including phone, messaging, etc), but have Debian 
repositories connected instead of nokia's and maemo.org's for everything 
else.

For packages that are free, use debian versions whenever possible.
For packages that are free but patched too much, use renamed packages.
For non-free packages, use current Nokia's binaries wrapped into hand-made 
debs.

If succeed, that may result into device that is as usable as n900 as a 
phone and (almost) as usable as debian for everything else.

What do you think?

Nikita

P.S.
Yes I know there is Easy Debian for n900, but I'm quite disappointed with 
it. I can't agree with idea of installing files into /home/user by dpkg, 
for example. Also, it completely ignores filesystem safety issues - some 
time of using it combined with phone reboots to recover from hangs, 
resulted into filesystem image that fsck was unable to repair.


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Re: Status of systemtap in Debian

[Ben Hutchings]

On Thu, 2010-02-18 at 15:00 +0100, Lucas Nussbaum wrote:
> On 18/02/10 at 14:31 +0100, Bastian Blank wrote:
> > > I's only a few hundreds of megabytes per kernel image.
> > 
> > Its around half a GiB per image.
> 
> Isn't that a correct instance of "a few hundreds of megabytes"? :)
[...]

I would object more to the 'only'.

Currently I can upload a ~230 MB i386 build in 2 hours or so.  Add debug
info to this for all 6 images and I'm looking at more than a day, by
which point I believe the incoming daemon would have given up waiting
for a complete upload.  Even if I switched to source+binary-all uploads,
some of our buildds are also on the slow end of an ADSL line and would
have the same problem.

Ben.

-- 
Ben Hutchings
Once a job is fouled up, anything done to improve it makes it worse.


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Re: Flag images

[gregor herrmann]

On Thu, 18 Feb 2010 00:11:15 +0100, Frank Lin PIAT wrote:

> > > On lun., 2010-02-15 at 12:03 -0800, Don Armstrong wrote:
> > > > Flags are a poor representation of a particular language, and language
> > > > selection is better handled using locales and content-negotiation
> > > > anyway. [There are many examples where a country speaks many
> > > > languages, and examples where multiple countries have the same
> > > > language, but different dialects.]

> I would love to get some comments from:
>  - people leaving in a country with many official languages.
>  - people leaving in a country which official language is the same
>to the one spoken in another language (or at least quite similar).
> Think of Ireland and UK ; Canada and USA ; Canada and France ;
> Spain and Argentina/Peru/Uruguay/Chile... 

... Austria and Germany ...
 
> People from Belgium are really nice people, but they certainly don't
> want to spend their life licking on one of the Dutch/French/German flag.

Some here with s/Belgium/Austria/ and a German flag.

And that's what Don already said: flags don't represent languages.
 
Cheers,
gregor
 
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Re: Debian Mobile -- Debian GNU/Linux for mobile devices

[Simon McVittie]

On Thu, 18 Feb 2010 at 17:51:35 +0300, Nikita V. Youshchenko wrote:
> For packages that are free, use debian versions whenever possible.
> For packages that are free but patched too much, use renamed packages.
> For non-free packages, use current Nokia's binaries wrapped into hand-made 
> debs.

Nokia's binaries are distributed under an EULA and are not legally
distributable (i.e. they couldn't go in non-free). I believe Mer has
some sort of hack analogous to Debian's game-data-packager, in which the
Nokia binaries are pushed into the installed device by (a script on behalf of)
each user, rather than being available through Mer.

S


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Re: Status of systemtap in Debian

[Philipp Kern]

On 2010-02-18, Ben Hutchings  wrote:
> Currently I can upload a ~230 MB i386 build in 2 hours or so.  Add debug
> info to this for all 6 images and I'm looking at more than a day, by
> which point I believe the incoming daemon would have given up waiting
> for a complete upload.  Even if I switched to source+binary-all uploads,
> some of our buildds are also on the slow end of an ADSL line and would
> have the same problem.

While I agree with your statement I need to state that those behind ADSL are
not the fast arches we would enable it on anyway.  (And even then we would
blacklist such huge uploads on those.)

(And ball got moved to manda, yayes!)

Kind regards,
Philipp Kern


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Re: why are the watchdog drivers blacklisted?

[Henrique de Moraes Holschuh]

On Mon, 08 Feb 2010, Henrique de Moraes Holschuh wrote:
> On Tue, 09 Feb 2010, Darren Salt wrote:
> > I demand that Guillem Jover may or may not have written...
> > > On Mon, 2010-02-08 at 20:15:30 +0100, Michael Meskes wrote:
> > >> Please keep in mind the OOM killer will only influence watchdog if it
> > >> happens to kill it. If you happen to run out of memory though, you can
> > >> tell watchdog to test if enough free mem is available.
> > 
> > > The OOM killer can be disabled for precious processes by writting the
> > > string "-17" to ???/proc//oom_adj???.
> > 
> > That sounds to me like a good thing to do by default.
> 
> And while at it, change wd_keepalive and watchdog to default to pat at 1Hz
> instead of 0.1Hz.  That will reduce a _lot_ the changes of spurious
> reboots.

For the record, the watchdog daemon seems not to be able to deal with 1Hz
cleanly (must have something to do with these zombies it likes to keep
around for 1s) in my test boxes.  It can do 0.5Hz just fine though.

-- 
  "One disk to rule them all, One disk to find them. One disk to bring
  them all and in the darkness grind them. In the Land of Redmond
  where the shadows lie." -- The Silicon Valley Tarot
  Henrique Holschuh


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Re: Status of systemtap in Debian

[Russ Allbery]

Troy Heber  writes:
> On 02/16/10 13:54, dann frazier wrote:

>> The kernel team discussed this at our face to face meeting (due to
>> some prompting from the 'crash' maintainer). 

> I didn't see this explicitly mentioned in the rest of the discussion,
> but debug kernel images are useful for more than just systemtap. It
> would make it much easier for our users to enable kdump in order to
> get kernel crash dumps. It would also let users run the crash debugger
> on the live system.

Yes, it would be helpful for debugging OpenAFS problems at times (although
that by itself isn't enough reason to enable them).

-- 
Russ Allbery (r...@debian.org)   


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Re: Status of systemtap in Debian

[Moritz Muehlenhoff]

On 2010-02-18, Ben Hutchings  wrote:
>
> --=-krd2Pvts3nDRsMxpCHn/
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
>
> On Thu, 2010-02-18 at 15:00 +0100, Lucas Nussbaum wrote:
>> On 18/02/10 at 14:31 +0100, Bastian Blank wrote:
>> > > I's only a few hundreds of megabytes per kernel image.
>> >=20
>> > Its around half a GiB per image.
>>=20
>> Isn't that a correct instance of "a few hundreds of megabytes"? :)
> [...]
>
> I would object more to the 'only'.
>
> Currently I can upload a ~230 MB i386 build in 2 hours or so.  Add debug
> info to this for all 6 images and I'm looking at more than a day, by
> which point I believe the incoming daemon would have given up waiting
> for a complete upload.  Even if I switched to source+binary-all uploads,
> some of our buildds are also on the slow end of an ADSL line and would
> have the same problem.

I'm also uncomfortable with this.
The increased build time for i386 also needs to be considered. It already
takes ages to build linux-2.6 on i386 due to the multitude of images and
adding one more doesn't help.

Cheers,
Moritz


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Re: Flag images

[Henrique de Moraes Holschuh]

On Mon, 15 Feb 2010, Alexander Reichle-Schmehl wrote:
> Dmitry E. Oboukhov schrieb:
> >> I wish to use my country's flag to refer to my language...
> >> Don't. There are many languages not associated with countries or in
> >> use in many different countries. [..]
> > Is it really so big problem? Looks like as non-issue, farfetched.
> 
> Believe me as someone who mentioned "Taiwan" and "Tibet" in a press
> announcement:  Such things aren't far fetched..

We lost Hebert Xu as a DD over it.  This is not a far-fetched issue at all.
In fact, it is a great potential source of aggravation at best.

-- 
  "One disk to rule them all, One disk to find them. One disk to bring
  them all and in the darkness grind them. In the Land of Redmond
  where the shadows lie." -- The Silicon Valley Tarot
  Henrique Holschuh


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Bug#570431: ITP: blokkal -- KDE blogging client

[Al Nikolov]

Package: wnpp
Severity: wishlist
Owner: Al Nikolov 


* Package name: blokkal
  Version : 0.1.2
  Upstream Author : Martin Mueller 
* URL : http://blokkal.sourceforge.net/
* License : GPL
  Programming Lang: C++
  Description : KDE blogging client

Blokkal is a KDE blogging client that supports multiple protocols and 
blogging sites. The goal is to provide a uniform way to access the 
most-commonly-used blogging systems. It has been designed for a maximum of 
modularity allowing for easy extension.



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Bug#570433: ITP: elexis -- medical practice managemant system for use in Switzerland

[Niklaus Giger]

Package: wnpp
Severity: wishlist
Owner: Niklaus Giger 


* Package name: elexis
  Version : 2.0
  Upstream Author : Gerry Weirich 
* URL : http://www.elexis.ch
* License : Eclipse Public License - v 1.0
  Programming Lang: Java (Eclipse Rich Client Platform)
  Description : medical practice managemant system for use in Switzerland

An Eclipse RCP program for all aspects of a medical practice: electronic
medical record (EMR), laboratory findings etc., as well as accounting,
billing (swiss TARMED-System, other systems to be developped) and
other daily work. 

Languages: German. French and english translation in work.

There seem to be a few users in Austria, too.



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Bug#570439: RFP: [PACKAGE] -- lessfs A high performance inline data deduplicating filesystem for Linux.

[Falk Hackenberger]

Package: wnpp
Severity: wishlist
X-Debbugs-CC: debian-devel@lists.debian.org

--- Please fill out the fields below. ---

   Package name: lessfs
Version: 1.0.1
Upstream Author: Mark Ruijter 
URL: http://www.lessfs.com
License: GPL version 3
Description: lessfs is an userspace (fuse) inline data
de-duplicating filesystem for Linux that includes support for lzo or
QuickLZ compression and encryption.




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gutenprint 5.2.5 release: testers with inkjet printers wanted

[Roger Leigh]

Hi folks,

I've packaged a new gutenprint release, 5.2.5-1, which is available from

  http://www.codelibre.net/~rleigh/gutenprint-5.2.5-1/

(source, amd64) or git

  git://git.debian.org/git/collab-maint/gutenprint.git

I no longer have an inkjet printer, so I can't verify the software works
correctly.  If you are a user of gutenprint, I'd greatly appreciate
confirmation that this is working correctly, especially for
cups-driver-gutenprint and gimp-gutenprint.

Due to the lack of printer for testing, and lack of time, this package
is looking for a new maintainer who can care better for it.  Please
get in touch if you are interested!


Thanks,
Roger

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 `. `'   Printing on GNU/Linux?   http://gutenprint.sourceforge.net/
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Work-needing packages report for Feb 19, 2010

[wnpp]

The following is a listing of packages for which help has been requested
through the WNPP (Work-Needing and Prospective Packages) system in the
last week.

Total number of orphaned packages: 556 (new: 5)
Total number of packages offered up for adoption: 134 (new: 2)
Total number of packages requested help for: 62 (new: 1)

Please refer to http://www.debian.org/devel/wnpp/ for more information.



The following packages have been orphaned:

   darcs-buildpackage (#570281), orphaned yesterday
 Description: Suite to help with Debian packages in Darcs archives
 Installations reported by Popcon: 195

   libcdk5 (#570267), orphaned yesterday
 Description: C-based curses widget library
 Reverse Depends: gphoto2 libcdk-perl libcdk5-dev licq-plugin-console
 Installations reported by Popcon: 2921

   pmtools (#569525), orphaned 6 days ago
 Description: Perl module tools
 Installations reported by Popcon: 145

   s3switch (#570188), orphaned yesterday
 Description: Manage the output device on S3 Savage chips
 Installations reported by Popcon: 42

   washngo (#570284), orphaned yesterday
 Description: Web Authoring System for Haskell
 Installations reported by Popcon: 5

551 older packages have been omitted from this listing, see
http://www.debian.org/devel/wnpp/orphaned for a complete list.



The following packages have been given up for adoption:

   mathml (#570333), offered today

   s3switch (#570188), offered yesterday
 Description: Manage the output device on S3 Savage chips
 Installations reported by Popcon: 42

132 older packages have been omitted from this listing, see
http://www.debian.org/devel/wnpp/rfa_bypackage for a complete list.



For the following packages help is requested:

[NEW] blender (#570053), requested 2 days ago
 Description: Very fast and versatile 3D modeller/renderer
 Reverse Depends: blender-ogrexml
 Installations reported by Popcon: 3165

   apt-cross (#540341), requested 195 days ago
 Description: retrieve, build and install libraries for
   cross-compiling
 Reverse Depends: apt-cross emdebian-buildsupport emdebian-qa
   emdebian-rootfs emdebian-tools libemdebian-tools-perl
 Installations reported by Popcon: 309

   apt-xapian-index (#567955), requested 17 days ago
 Description: maintenance tools for a Xapian index of Debian packages
 Reverse Depends: adept ept-cache
 Installations reported by Popcon: 4323

   ara (#450876), requested 830 days ago
 Description: utility for searching the Debian package database
 Installations reported by Popcon: 113

   asymptote (#517342), requested 356 days ago
 Description: script-based vector graphics language inspired by
   MetaPost
 Installations reported by Popcon: 1214

   athcool (#278442), requested 1941 days ago
 Description: Enable powersaving mode for Athlon/Duron processors
 Installations reported by Popcon: 163

   boinc (#511243), requested 406 days ago
 Description: BOINC distributed computing
 Reverse Depends: boinc-app-milkyway boinc-app-seti boinc-dbg
 Installations reported by Popcon: 1657

   cvs (#354176), requested 1456 days ago
 Description: Concurrent Versions System
 Reverse Depends: crossvc cvs-autoreleasedeb cvs-buildpackage cvs2cl
   cvs2html cvschangelogbuilder cvsconnect cvsd cvsps cvsservice (10
   more omitted)
 Installations reported by Popcon: 25500

   dctrl-tools (#448284), requested 845 days ago
 Description: Command-line tools to process Debian package
   information
 Reverse Depends: aptfs debian-goodies debtree dlocate
   haskell-devscripts javahelper libsbuild-perl linux-patch-debianlogo
   simple-cdd ubuntu-dev-tools
 Installations reported by Popcon: 13556

   debtags (#567954), requested 17 days ago
 Description: Enables support for package tags
 Reverse Depends: debtags-edit goplay packagesearch
 Installations reported by Popcon: 2785

   dietlibc (#544060), requested 174 days ago
 Description: diet libc - a libc optimized for small size
 Reverse Depends: libowfat-dev
 Installations reported by Popcon: 229

   doc-central (#566364), requested 26 days ago
 Description: web-based documentation browser
 Installations reported by Popcon: 303

   dpkg (#282283), requested 1915 days ago
 Description: dselect: a user tool to manage Debian packages
 Reverse Depends: acct adacontrol advi advi-examples alien alqalam
   alsa-source am-utils-doc apt-build apt-cross (491 more omitted)
 Installations reported by Popcon: 90951

   elvis (#432298), requested 955 days ago
 Description: powerful clone of the vi/ex text editor (with X11
   support)
 Reverse Depends: elvis elvi