Re: ITP: debian-backports-keyring -- GnuPG archive key of the backports.org repository

[Chris Bannister]

On Mon, Jun 23, 2008 at 12:49:50PM -0500, William Pitcock wrote:
> Have you ever heard the fable concerning a father, a son and a donkey?
> In a nutshell, first, nobody rides down the road on the donkey, and
> instead lead him with a rope. People criticized them for doing so, e.g.
> "why not let the kid ride on top of the donkey?"
> 
> So, the father told the kid to ride the donkey. Then people criticized
> them again, for not letting the father ride the donkey instead. So, they
> switched again. Then people criticized that too, so they wound up
> carrying the donkey. Eventually, they reached a stream and fell in the
> water because there was too much weight in once place on the bridge they
> were crossing.

Wouldn't that happen whether they were riding or carrying the donkey?

-- 
Chris.
==
"One, with God, is always a majority, but many a martyr has been burned
   at the stake while the votes were being counted."  -- Thomas B. Reed


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Re: ITP: debian-backports-keyring -- GnuPG archive key of the backports.org repository

[William Pitcock]

On Sun, 2008-06-29 at 19:12 +1200, Chris Bannister wrote:
> On Mon, Jun 23, 2008 at 12:49:50PM -0500, William Pitcock wrote:
> > Have you ever heard the fable concerning a father, a son and a donkey?
> > In a nutshell, first, nobody rides down the road on the donkey, and
> > instead lead him with a rope. People criticized them for doing so, e.g.
> > "why not let the kid ride on top of the donkey?"
> > 
> > So, the father told the kid to ride the donkey. Then people criticized
> > them again, for not letting the father ride the donkey instead. So, they
> > switched again. Then people criticized that too, so they wound up
> > carrying the donkey. Eventually, they reached a stream and fell in the
> > water because there was too much weight in once place on the bridge they
> > were crossing.
> 
> Wouldn't that happen whether they were riding or carrying the donkey?

Mathematically, probably. But this is just a fable, so the laws of
physics obviously don't apply completely here.

William



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Bug#488488: ITP: kita2 -- Ruby based 2ch client for KDE

[Hiroyuki Yamamoto]

Package: wnpp
Severity: wishlist
X-Debbugs-CC: debian-devel@lists.debian.org


   Package name: kita2
Version: 1.90.2.1
Upstream Author: Hideki Ikemoto <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
URL: http://kita.sourceforge.jp/


License:
Copyright (c) 2008 Hideki Ikemoto

Permission is hereby granted, free of charge, to any person obtaining
a copy of this software and associated documentation files (the
"Software"), to deal in the Software without restriction, including
without limitation the rights to use, copy, modify, merge, publish,
distribute, sublicense, and/or sell copies of the Software, and to
permit persons to whom the Software is furnished to do so, subject to
the following conditions:

The above copyright notice and this permission notice shall be
included in all copies or substantial portions of the Software.

THE SOFTWARE IS PROVIDED "AS IS", WITHOUT WARRANTY OF ANY KIND,
EXPRESS OR IMPLIED, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO THE WARRANTIES OF
MERCHANTABILITY, FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE AND
NONINFRINGEMENT. IN NO EVENT SHALL THE AUTHORS OR COPYRIGHT HOLDERS BE
LIABLE FOR ANY CLAIM, DAMAGES OR OTHER LIABILITY, WHETHER IN AN ACTION
OF CONTRACT, TORT OR OTHERWISE, ARISING FROM, OUT OF OR IN CONNECTION
WITH THE SOFTWARE OR THE USE OR OTHER DEALINGS IN THE SOFTWARE.


Description: Ruby based 2ch client for KDE
 Kita2 is useful to view "2ch-style Bulletin Board System" that use
"bbs.cgi"
 and "read.cgi", it is like that we use RSS reader to read blogs. It helps
 you to read/write articles in such BBS.
 .
 2ch-style BBS include
  - 2 channel (http://www.2ch.net, largest BBS in Japan)
  - Pink channel (http://www.bbspink.com/)
  - Machi-BBS (http://www.machi.to/)
  - Shitaraba (http://rentalbbs.livedoor.com/jbbs/) and so on.




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Re: Dpkg triggers and user experience, aka "How do I disable those triggers" side effect.

[Bernhard R. Link]

* Franklin PIAT <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [080628 23:12]:
> > Indeed, when I run an "apt dist-upgrade", I just launch the
> > command, look at the list of actions that are planned, hit "Y" to
> > confirm and just switch to another window and come back some hours
> > later.
>
> When I run "apt-get install foo", I want it to be damed fast, since I need
> to continue my work.

I think this is a very important usability factor.

Please note that there are not only experiened users that have
confidence in their understanding of the system and the system itself
but also people not having that background.

Fiddling with package management is usually quite a critical point: You
often do not do what exactly it does, so reverting it manually will not
be possible. Thus if you lack confidence, installing or removing
packages means quite some stress, and the earlier it is finished the
earlier you leave that unhealthy state.

At least that is my experience when using other systems like Yast on
SuSe: There are some interfaces I do not fully understand, it does some
things related to what I asked it, and then is writes several minutes
(at least it feels like that) with doing things that seem totally
unrelated (I guess it just rewrites some config and has suboptimal
triggers when to write what).

I guess unexperienced people might feel the same when seeing this
triggers. (Even I are sometimes at loss why it does specific things,
for example updating mandb after I try to install a package but that
failed).

Hochachtungsvoll,
Bernhard R. Link
-- 
"Never contain programs so few bugs, as when no debugging tools are available!"
Niklaus Wirth


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Re: inotify and symlinks in /etc/udev/rules.d/

[Marco d'Itri]

On Jun 26, Rafael Laboissiere <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> > > Are there plans to enforce files under /etc/udev/rules.d/ being regular
> > > files in Debian, as they are in Ubuntu?
> > Enforce, no. Highly recommend, yes.
> Could you please point me to where the discussion about this have taken
> place and/or where I can find the recommendation you mention?
I maintain udev, so I speak with some authority on this.


(BTW, is there anybody who is interested in helping me with to package
a new udev release? I mostly need help to triage over six months of
mostly ignored bugs. Send applications to me privately.)

-- 
ciao,
Marco


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Re: RFH: curl, c-ares and ipv6

[Marco d'Itri]

On Jun 26, Andreas Schuldei <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Could someone with ipv6 connectivity please test the curl
> packages (version 7.18.2-1e1) in experimental[1] and verify that the
Everybody can have IPv6 connectivity, just download and run (on a
non-NAT'ed host) this script: http://www.linux.it/~md/6to4 .

-- 
ciao,
Marco


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OT: bridges

[Henrique de Moraes Holschuh]

On Sun, 29 Jun 2008, William Pitcock wrote:
> On Sun, 2008-06-29 at 19:12 +1200, Chris Bannister wrote:
> > On Mon, Jun 23, 2008 at 12:49:50PM -0500, William Pitcock wrote:
> > > Have you ever heard the fable concerning a father, a son and a donkey?
> > > In a nutshell, first, nobody rides down the road on the donkey, and
> > > instead lead him with a rope. People criticized them for doing so, e.g.
> > > "why not let the kid ride on top of the donkey?"
> > > 
> > > So, the father told the kid to ride the donkey. Then people criticized
> > > them again, for not letting the father ride the donkey instead. So, they
> > > switched again. Then people criticized that too, so they wound up
> > > carrying the donkey. Eventually, they reached a stream and fell in the
> > > water because there was too much weight in once place on the bridge they
> > > were crossing.
> > 
> > Wouldn't that happen whether they were riding or carrying the donkey?
> 
> Mathematically, probably. But this is just a fable, so the laws of

Quite the opposite.  Load distribution CAN matter a damn great deal.
The fable could be correct, if the bridge it describes is a weak one.

-- 
  "One disk to rule them all, One disk to find them. One disk to bring
  them all and in the darkness grind them. In the Land of Redmond
  where the shadows lie." -- The Silicon Valley Tarot
  Henrique Holschuh


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Bug#458809: ITP for libxml-atom-service-perl

[angel]

Package: wnpp
Followup-For: Bug #458809
Owner: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

I have make the package version 0.16.0 and i will upload to sponsors.debian.net

Bye!

-- System Information:
Debian Release: lenny/sid
  APT prefers unstable
  APT policy: (500, 'unstable')
Architecture: amd64 (x86_64)

Kernel: Linux 2.6.25-2-amd64 (SMP w/1 CPU core)
Locale: LANG=es_ES.UTF-8, LC_CTYPE=es_ES.UTF-8 (charmap=UTF-8)
Shell: /bin/sh linked to /bin/bash



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[VAC] July-September 08

[David Paleino]

(sorry for all those CCs...)

Hello,
I'm going on [VAC]ation from July to September. I will *not* have any Internet
connection, so don't expect any reply from me. I might have a connection on
weekends, and that would mean that I might reply to your mail in "batch mode".

Please, if any of my Debian packages need work, love and/or attention, feel free
to make NMU uploads. I'll acknowledge them as soon as I get back home. I don't
want to make Debian less reliable and more buggy because of my lack of
connectivty :)

If you need me regarding my other FOSS work, please forgive my lack of
participation. I'm probably working to code also off-line, but can't
communicate this to anyone.

If you need to contact me regarding the Italian HackMeeting 08, please write to
the SputniX LUG in Palermo , asking for a contact with
me -- they'll know how to reach me in real life.

Take care,
David Paleino

-- 
 . ''`.  Debian maintainer | http://wiki.debian.org/DavidPaleino
 : :'  : Linuxer #334216 --|-- http://www.hanskalabs.net/
 `. `'`  GPG: 1392B174 | http://snipr.com/qa_page
   `-   2BAB C625 4E66 E7B8 450A C3E1 E6AA 9017 1392 B174


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Re: Dpkg triggers and user experience, aka "How do I disable those triggers" side effect.

[Andreas Tille]

On Sat, 28 Jun 2008, Christian Perrier wrote:


Are you basing this assumption on somethign really experienced?


It is even documented on debian-devel:

http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2008/06/msg00117.html


Indeed, when I run an "apt dist-upgrade", I just launch the
command, look at the list of actions that are planned, hit "Y" to
confirm and just switch to another window and come back some hours
later.


Well, I have more than one window on my desktop and sometimes look at
the process that continuosely spits out lines I never realised before ...


In short, I don't really care to read what's happening or displayed on
my screen..:-)


I'd regard this as a grand fathers phenomenon: Beeing unable to
concentrate on more than one thing. ;-


Do you think that real users will worry about mysterious actions
happening after package installs?


Honestly, I think so.  Especially new users who are not yet comfortable
with the fact that in Debian most things went very smoothly and you
do not need to observe continuosely.

Kind regards

  Andreas.

--
http://fam-tille.de


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Bug#488522: ITP: libxml-atom-service-perl -- Perl module for Atom Service Document object

[angel]

Package: wnpp
Severity: wishlist
Owner: [EMAIL PROTECTED]


* Package name: libxml-atom-service-perl
  Version : x.y.z
  Upstream Author : Takeru Inoue <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
* URL : http://search.cpan.org/dist/XML-Atom-Service/
* License : Perl-like (GPL/Artistic)
  Programming Lang: Perl
  Description : Perl module for Atom Service Document object

 XML::Atom::Service is a Service Document implementation. In the Atom
 Publishing Protocol, a client needs to first discover the capabilities
 and locations of Collections. The Service Document is designed to
 support this discovery process. The document describes the location and
 capabilities of Collections.
 .
 The Atom Publishing Protocol introduces some new XML elements, such as 
 app:edited and app:draft, which are imported into XML::Atom. See 
 XML::Atom::Atompub in detail.


-- System Information:
Debian Release: lenny/sid
  APT prefers unstable
  APT policy: (500, 'unstable')
Architecture: amd64 (x86_64)

Kernel: Linux 2.6.25-2-amd64 (SMP w/1 CPU core)
Locale: LANG=es_ES.UTF-8, LC_CTYPE=es_ES.UTF-8 (charmap=UTF-8)
Shell: /bin/sh linked to /bin/bash



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Re: DPL teams survey summary summary

[Stefano Zacchiroli]

On Sun, Jun 29, 2008 at 04:20:00PM +0100, Steve McIntyre wrote:
> 6. I found that people from quite a number of teams responded to the
>survey, despite not being on my initial target list. That's not a
>surprise! However, a more comprehensive, canonical single list of
>teams would be very nice to have. Currently there are multiple
>incomplete team lists scattered all over the place; that's not very
>useful.

> 8. Publicise more clearly the places where new people could help
>out. I'm commonly asked by people how they could get involved in
>Debian, or what tasks most urgently need help, and those are quite
>difficult things to answer. A more focussed set of web pages and/or
>wiki pages targeting these questions would be a great thing to
>have.

To both these issues, I find that http://wiki.debian.org/Teams is a good
solution. IMO it simply needs to be more advertised.

As it seems to go precisely in the direction you have in mind, any
specific reason for not mentioning it explicitly in your report mail?
(though it is never too late :-)) It would have been a good
advertisement for an initiative which has good chances to fulfill the
needs you pointed out.


Beside that, many thanks for your report/initiative! (from a lazy ass
which did not find the time to reply to your survey, shame on me)

Cheers.

-- 
Stefano Zacchiroli -*- PhD in Computer Science \ PostDoc @ Univ. Paris 7
[EMAIL PROTECTED],pps.jussieu.fr,debian.org} -<>- http://upsilon.cc/zack/
I'm still an SGML person,this newfangled /\ All one has to do is hit the
XML stuff is so ... simplistic  -- Manoj \/ right keys at the right time


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Re: Please focus on one generic spell checker in Debian (Was: Bug#487732: O: ispell -- International Ispell (an interactive spelling corrector))

[Hendrik Sattler]

Am Mittwoch, 25. Juni 2008 21:53:24 schrieb Agustin Martin:
> Each spellchecker has currently some special features. Fortunately, the
> only thing where ispell is stronger than the other spellcheckers (support
> for pseudocharsets like 'a, "a, \'a, ... ) is already included in aspell
> development version, so at that time we can drop ispell without any loss
> of features. Not sure about hunspell here.

What tools are using such pseudo characters, probably because they do not 
support 8bit character sets? Can't they be fixed to do so?
AFAIK, even latex knows the existence of the 8th bit, nowadays.

HS


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Bug#488547: ITP: python-mox -- a mock object framework for Python

[Iustin Pop]

Package: wnpp
Severity: wishlist
Owner: Iustin Pop <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

* Package name: python-mox
  Version : 0.5.0
  Upstream Author : Google Inc.
* URL : http://code.google.com/p/pymox/
* License : Apache-2.0
  Programming Lang: Python
  Description : a mock object framework for Python

Mox is a mock object framework for Python.

Mox is based on EasyMock, a Java mock object framework.

Mox will make mock objects for you, so you don't have to create your
own. It mocks the public/protected interfaces of Python objects. You set
up your mock objects expected behavior using a domain specific language
(DSL), which makes it easy to use, understand, and refactor.

-- System Information:
Debian Release: lenny/sid
  APT prefers unstable
  APT policy: (500, 'unstable'), (500, 'stable'), (1, 'experimental')
Architecture: amd64 (x86_64)

Kernel: Linux 2.6.25.8-teal (SMP w/2 CPU cores)
Locale: LANG=en_US.UTF-8, LC_CTYPE=en_US.UTF-8 (charmap=UTF-8)
Shell: /bin/sh linked to /bin/dash



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Re: Bug#488522: ITP: libxml-atom-service-perl -- Perl module for Atom Service Document object

[Jaldhar H. Vyas]

This package has already been in Debian for quite some time.

--
Jaldhar H. Vyas <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
La Salle Debain - http://www.braincells.com/debian/


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Fwd: Diarna real estate

[Diarna Real estate]

  
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Dear Custmer  We are Diarna 
real Estate company home of the real estate marketing company specializing in 
the area real estate , We are agents of Demac Egypt, which has several projects 
in Cairo, the draft new cairo for United of villas and palaces, and another 
project in the 6th October is a commercial center where many shops for sale 
For information contact us:
Reda elmenshawy
+20107719368
+20107719370
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Do not hesitate to contact us we are 
open 24 hours and will find answer to all your questions:
tel: +20222725901 / +20226703714
fax: +20222879890
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]   
-

  
  




  Diarna Real Estate in Egypt:
6 Aul may building - nasr city - nasr rood - 2nd floor - office 209
tell: 22725901 / 22879890
email: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
websait: www.diarna.net   

-
  Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your homepage. 


   

Re: Please focus on one generic spell checker in Debian (Was: Bug#487732: O: ispell -- International Ispell (an interactive spelling corrector))

[Michael Tautschnig]

> Am Mittwoch, 25. Juni 2008 21:53:24 schrieb Agustin Martin:
> > Each spellchecker has currently some special features. Fortunately, the
> > only thing where ispell is stronger than the other spellcheckers (support
> > for pseudocharsets like 'a, "a, \'a, ... ) is already included in aspell
> > development version, so at that time we can drop ispell without any loss
> > of features. Not sure about hunspell here.
> 
> What tools are using such pseudo characters, probably because they do not 
> support 8bit character sets? Can't they be fixed to do so?
> AFAIK, even latex knows the existence of the 8th bit, nowadays.
> 

Yes, LaTeX does fully support this, but portability of plain files across
systems remains an issue and many people thus still prefer to encode umlauts
this way. For example, we often share files between Linux, Windows, OS X client.
In such situations, 8bit is still horribly unreliable. In theory, of course all
of them support 8bit.

Best,
Michael



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Bug#488587: ITP: amora-server -- allows applications to be remote controlled by mobile phone

[Axel Beckert]

Package: wnpp
Owner: Axel Beckert <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Severity: wishlist

* Package name: amora-server
  Version : 1.1
  Upstream Author : Adenilson Cavalcanti da Silva
* URL or Web page : http://code.google.com/p/amora/
* License : GPLv2
  Description : allows X to be remote controlled by mobile phone

Amora (A mobile remote assistant) is an application that enables you
to control your desktop using your mobile phone. It uses bluetooth to
send mouse and keyboard events to the X session. With it, you can
control your presentations, movies or any other application which
mainly uses mouse and cursor keys.

Amora also has a screenshot feature, where you can see a thumbnail of
the currently focused window on the mobile phone.

Currently only Symbian Series 60 mobile phones are supported.

This package contains the daemon running on the to be remote
controlled computer. The client has to be installed on the mobile
phone and is not contained in the package. It can be downloaded from
the home page of the project.

--end of description--

There are already minimal .deb packages available from upstream, but
they do not yet meet Debian standards in many points. I'm in contact
with upstream to make those packages ready for Debian (and of course
maintain them afterwards).

Current version is 1.0, but 1.1 is planned to be released in a few
weeks and the server side part of 1.1 is said to be already finished.

Regards, Axel
-- 
Axel Beckert - [EMAIL PROTECTED] - http://abe.home.pages.de/



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Re: Bug#488578: module-init-tools: modprobe spams syslog heavily

[Sami Liedes]

package module-init-tools
reopen 488578
thanks

[Cc: to debian-devel since it seems we could use a third opinion]

Sorry for being an ass and reopening the bug the second time, but I
just think you are wrong about this one.

Some background to d-d:

This bug is about modprobe spamming syslog a hundred times a minute
about a module (ipv6) being not loaded since it's blacklisted. The
warning is actually a Debian-specific modification, in
debian/patches/blacklist-warn.diff. It causes the syslog being spammed
every time an application tries to create an AF_INET6 socket, which
I'd consider quite a valid thing for an application to do.

Of course I might be mistaken and there is a better solution, one that
does not involve modifying or configuring every application,
recompiling the kernel, or doing extreme things like deleting the
module.

Either that or or giving up and de-blacklisting the ipv6 module, which
is big, messy, draws in 10 other modules and does not support
unloading, and modifying a lot of obscure things like
net.ipv6.conf.default.accept_ra just so that I can get to
ftp.fi.debian.org which happens to have an IPv6 address over a network
which doesn't correctly support IPv6 but possibly has some nice rogue
DHCP machine or something that gives me an IPv6 address. And that
can't be done in /etc/sysctl.conf (I tried), my guess is because the
module is not loaded at the time that configuration is applied.

If that is the case, I'd very much like to hear about that solution;
but lacking that solution, getting syslog spammed every time an
application tries to create an inet6 socket just is a bug. I don't
know if it's a bug in modprobe, but I cannot think where it is if not
there.

What's the rationale for warning about trying to load blacklisted
modules anyway? Aren't they blacklisted so they won't load when
something tries to?

On Mon, Jun 30, 2008 at 12:15:15AM +0200, Marco d'Itri wrote:
> On Jun 30, Sami Liedes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> 
> > So the solution you propose is configure every single application (all
> > of which may not be configurable to not open AF_INET6 sockets) because
> > modprobe wants to spam syslog about doing things it's been asked to
> > do?
> Yes. It's not like blacklisting an AFI is a smart idea anyway.
> Since you like stupid workarounds you could as well delete the module.

Perhaps you could tell me why it's so stupid to not want to load that
module.

> > Sorry, I just can't agree with you here, at least not with the
> > rationale you gave.
> Too bad, I am the maintainer.

Perhaps you could reassign it to a more relevant package then?

Sami


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Re: Dpkg triggers and user experience, aka "How do I disable those triggers" side effect.

[Charles Plessy]

>> Maybe "Processing triggers" could be replaced by a 2-3 word summary of
>> what the trigger is really doing?

> What about "Processing delayed configuration"?

Well, I was originally thinking about someting specific for each
trigger, but your proposition is probably sufficient and simpler to
implement.

Have a nice day,

-- 
Charles


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Re: Testing removal policy (was: Mechanism in place...)

[Mike Bird]

On Sun June 29 2008 17:59:27 Frans Pop wrote:
> Again, the only things you (the release team) have managed to achieve with
> this are:
> - cosmetically improving the RC stats for testing
> - annoying developers and users

There's at least one other consequence.  Some of us pointed out
that the new release team was making a serious mistake some time
ago.  Lacking any logical arguments to defend their changes, they
simply ordered the listmaster to block critics from posting to
debian-release.

On Wed June 4 2008 13:53:58 Steve McIntyre wrote:
> We've made it abundantly clear over the years why our version
> of testing exists and how it's going to be managed. End of story.

Is the DPL a big enough man to admit he made a mistake and to
end the censorship of people who pointed up problems with the
way the new release team handles Testing?

--Mike Bird


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