Re: kernel-package hooks transition

[Bernhard R. Link]

* Colin Watson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [051224 18:30]:
> The fd 3 redirection (and the corresponding redirection of stdout to
> stderr in the shell confmodule) was always acknowledged as a nasty hack
> in debconf. At the time, as I understand it, Joey reckoned it was easier
> to do that than to try to get everyone to change maintainer script code
> that used stdout. 

It may be an ugly hack, but I think it was predictable that it was
necessary. (postinst is quite an complex thing to expect widely used
things like stdin and stdout to be secure to use).

> It has various undesirable consequences, such as the
> requirement to call db_stop before starting daemons that don't take care
> to close down all their file descriptors,

Hopefully people will not only call db_stop, but also fix the buggy
daemon. (And I almost consider this a good consequence, as it makes it a
bit easier to find buggy code, even security-relvant buggy code)

> and some very weird
> workarounds in the confmodule bindings for other languages (see the
> changelog entry for debconf 0.3.74).

That is more a problem of inconsistency. I never understood why those
scripts are not called debconf communication at fds 3 and 4. (and put
/dev/null in stdin and something else to avoi things reading from it)
This way only buggy daemons would cause problems. (and beside fd_stop, 
just give them 3>/dev/null to work around)

Hochachtungsvoll,
  Bernhard R. Link


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Re: kernel-package hooks transition

[Sven Luther]

On Sun, Dec 25, 2005 at 01:50:35PM -0800, Steve Langasek wrote:
> On Sun, Dec 25, 2005 at 03:34:43PM +, Colin Watson wrote:
> > The STOP command causes the debconf frontend to shut down; that would
> > certainly break anything trying to talk to debconf after it. May be
> > worth removing that and seeing if things start working.
> 
> > I haven't checked if kernel-package runs anything else that would
> > require it to use STOP. It seems a little unlikely that it would be
> > starting up any daemons, though. Note a common misconception: the STOP
> > command does *not* put your file descriptors back the way they were
> > before you started the debconf frontend.
> 
> Indeed, not only does STOP not restore your file descriptors, it also leaves
> a sentinel value in the environment which prevents debconf-using children
> from successfully restarting the frontend.  STOP should only be used when
> you need to force-kill the frontend because of other processes that will
> otherwise leave dangling file descriptors open to it after your scripts
> exit.

Ok, then this is probably the root of the problem here.

Kernel-package does call db_stop, before calling the hooks, since it has no
guarantee that the hooks will behave properly.

I understand that the intention of Manoj was to restore the file descriptors
in order to have hooks like grub-update be able to send output to stdout, not
for the other reason Colin mentioned, having to deal with daemons. Colin could
you giive a bit more detail on how this daemon trick works and what the issue
is ? Is it possible that a random kernel hook would be starting such a daemon
? right now i don't think this is done, nor is it the job of the kernel hooks,
but one never knows, and i believe this has to be properly documented in the
kernel-package documentation.

Friendly,

Sven Luther


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Re: Your Confirmation Required

[Laszlo Boszormenyi]

Hi all,

On Mon, 2005-12-26 at 08:40 +0300, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> This message is to verify that you wish to have your
> email address: debian-devel@lists.debian.org added to the
> Alharamain Sermon(english)
> Subscribe Me mailing list.
 Can't we just filter out these messages?

Regards,
Laszlo/GCS


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Re: /run vs. /lib/run

[David Weinehall]

On Mon, Dec 19, 2005 at 09:58:30PM -0600, Peter Samuelson wrote:
> 
> [Thomas Hood]
> > Any other defenders of /lib/run?  Of /run?
> 
> /etc/run.  mtab and resolv.conf and the lvm1 state files and so forth
> always lived in /etc before, so there's continuity.

Oh please, let's not dump even more crap into /etc; it's ugly enough
as it is...


Regards: David Weinehall
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Re: kernel-package hooks transition

[Manoj Srivastava]

On Mon, 26 Dec 2005 10:45:52 +0100, Sven Luther <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said: 

> Ok, then this is probably the root of the problem here.

> Kernel-package does call db_stop, before calling the hooks, since it
> has no guarantee that the hooks will behave properly.

Past tense. This has not been the case for a couple of uploads
of kernel-package now.

> I understand that the intention of Manoj was to restore the file
> descriptors in order to have hooks like grub-update be able to send
> output to stdout, not for the other reason Colin mentioned, having
> to deal with daemons. Colin could you giive a bit more detail on how
> this daemon trick works and what the issue is ?

Is this not flogging a dead horse?

> Is it possible that a random kernel hook would be starting such a
> daemon ? right now i don't think this is done, nor is it the job of
> the kernel hooks, but one never knows, and i believe this has to be
> properly documented in the kernel-package documentation.

I see no reason to restrict a hook script from starting a
 daemon, but that is neither here nor there.

manoj
-- 
We don't need no education, we don't need no thought control. Pink
Floyd
Manoj Srivastava   <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>  
1024D/BF24424C print 4966 F272 D093 B493 410B  924B 21BA DABB BF24 424C


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Re: Thoughts on Debian quality, including automated testing

[Anthony Towns]

On Sat, Dec 24, 2005 at 10:11:57AM +0100, Frank Küster wrote:
> > The difference is who does the work. 
> I a well-team-maintained package, the work is actually done by "the
> team", and decisions are made after finding a consensus solution in the
> team.

It's nice to know who the team actually *is* though; having a
team.debian.org webpage or something where such things could be listed
would be lovely.

(So that you can tell if both/all the team is on holidays, if a response
from someone is official, who to try talking to on irc to get an immediate
response, etc; looking through changelogs, or mailing list archives
is okay, but not terribly convenient, especially for team members who
happen not to post a lot, or happen not to upload a lot)

I really hate looking at packages maintained by a list because
I never know who's actually behind it.

(There's plenty of ways to make that not a problem, such as using the
Uploaders: field; but the above might be a useful datapoint)

Cheers,
aj



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Bug#344843: ITP: aspell-hr -- The Croatian dictionary for GNU Aspell

[Vedran Furač]

Package: wnpp
Severity: wishlist
Owner: "Vedran Furač" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>


* Package name: aspell-hr
  Version : x.y.z
  Upstream Author : Denis Lacković <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
* URL : ftp://ftp.gnu.org/gnu/aspell/dict/hr
* License : LGPL
  Description : The Croatian dictionary for GNU Aspell

This package contains all the required files to add support
for Croatian language to the GNU Aspell spell checker.

-- System Information:
Debian Release: testing/unstable
  APT prefers unstable
  APT policy: (900, 'unstable'), (800, 'experimental'), (500, 'testing'), (55, 
'breezy')
Architecture: i386 (i686)
Shell:  /bin/sh linked to /bin/bash
Kernel: Linux 2.6.14-acid2
Locale: LANG=hr_HR.UTF-8, LC_CTYPE=en_US.UTF-8 (charmap=UTF-8)

Re: Your Confirmation Required

[Brad Sims]

On Monday 26 December 2005 5:25 am, Laszlo Boszormenyi wrote:
> Can't we just filter out these messages?

Bogofilter seems to do a good job on them locally ; but you are right
that domain could be blacklisted for all I care.
-- 
He doesn't complain, but his self-righteousness sure gets on my nerves.
-- Calvin


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Bug#344850: ITP: myspell-hr -- Croatian dictionary for myspell

[Vedran Furač]

Package: wnpp
Severity: wishlist
Owner: "Vedran Furač" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>


* Package name: myspell-hr
  Version : x.y.z
  Upstream Author : Denis Lacković <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
* URL : http://ftp.linux.hr/pub/spell/myspell/hr_HR.zip
* License : LGPL
  Description : Croatian dictionary for myspell

This is the Croatian dictionary for use with the myspell spellchecker
which is currently used within OpenOffice.org and the mozilla
spellchecker.

-- System Information:
Debian Release: testing/unstable
  APT prefers unstable
  APT policy: (900, 'unstable'), (800, 'experimental'), (500, 'testing'), (55, 
'breezy')
Architecture: i386 (i686)
Shell:  /bin/sh linked to /bin/bash
Kernel: Linux 2.6.14-acid2
Locale: LANG=hr_HR.UTF-8, LC_CTYPE=en_US.UTF-8 (charmap=UTF-8)

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Re: Size matters. Debian binary package stats

[Goswin von Brederlow]

Adam Heath <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

> On Sun, 25 Dec 2005, Goswin von Brederlow wrote:
>
>> > debs are created by debian/rules.  So, only dependencies of dpkg would 
>> > have to
>> > be modified.
>>
>> I was talking about the hypothetical situation of dpkg defaulting to
>> !gzip compression and adding a Pre-Depends to the dpkg version
>> required for unpacking. The buildd would have to override that for
>> core packages.
>
> No, the packages themselves would include such logic in their debian/rules.
> There's no way we'd want to keep buildds in sync with what the set of core
> packages is.

That would realy defeat the purpose of not having to modify every deb.

> And, besides, libc6.deb is core, but is libc6-dev?  Or it's documentation?

Definetly as nearly everyone has it installed and it has a strict
versioned depend (not the docs). And that one is the easiest to spot.

MfG
Goswin


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Re: Size matters. Debian binary package stats

[Adam Heath]

On Tue, 27 Dec 2005, Goswin von Brederlow wrote:

> > No, the packages themselves would include such logic in their debian/rules.
> > There's no way we'd want to keep buildds in sync with what the set of core
> > packages is.
>
> That would realy defeat the purpose of not having to modify every deb.

We'd only modify the set of packages that are in base.  That's a very small
set.  Are you thinking the opposite?


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Re: Size matters. Debian binary package stats

[Ron Johnson]

On Tue, 2005-12-27 at 02:17 +0100, Goswin von Brederlow wrote:
> Adam Heath <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> 
> > On Sun, 25 Dec 2005, Goswin von Brederlow wrote:
> >
> >> > debs are created by debian/rules.  So, only dependencies of dpkg would 
> >> > have to
> >> > be modified.
> >>
> >> I was talking about the hypothetical situation of dpkg defaulting to
> >> !gzip compression and adding a Pre-Depends to the dpkg version
> >> required for unpacking. The buildd would have to override that for
> >> core packages.
> >
> > No, the packages themselves would include such logic in their debian/rules.
> > There's no way we'd want to keep buildds in sync with what the set of core
> > packages is.
> 
> That would realy defeat the purpose of not having to modify every deb.

Why not "just" modify them the next time they are scheduled to be
built from source?

It occurs to me, though: while adding a {g|b}zip stage to the i386,
amd64, ppc, ia64, etc build  wouldn't be noticed that much by 2GHz
CPUs, it *would* be noticed by 40MHz 68Ks.  Is there a way to make
the compression conditional on the CPU?

-- 
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Jefferson, LA USA

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he evolved a strikingly clear concept of where the industry was
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spohr.debian.org not sending email

[Anand Kumria]

Hi,

There seems to be a problem, localised to spohr, with the sending of
emails. I've uploaded some packages recently and have neither received
the acceptance nor rejection emails (as expected) however some packages
have been accepted since they are currently auto-building.

I've tested various others Debian infrastructure machines and no other
appears to have an issue.  I've not seen anything mentioning this issue
(hence the CC to debian-devel in case anyone else is experiencing the
problem).

Please take a look at see what is happening for the domains:
progsoc.uts.edu.au and progsoc.org

Thanks,
Anand

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Re: Your Confirmation Required

[Xavier Roche]

On Tue, 27 Dec 2005 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
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Couldn't we have a BLACKLIST to filter out spamme^Widiots who can not
handle properly their spamm^mailing lists ?

Like
alharamainsermons.org   571 Bye

Just by 15c remark.


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