Re: no freshness dating inside Packages.gz

[Bernd Eckenfels]

On Tue, Jun 17, 2003 at 08:29:14PM -0400, Joey Hess wrote:
> He wants to know when a particular package was last updated, without
> having to download it and examine the gzip time stamp and/or changelog.

It is unfortunate, that there is no easy access to the changelog, I know of,
but all other infos can be seen on the package tracking system:

http://packages.qa.debian.org/a/adns.html

This also includes the change notification mails. For me, this is good
enough, but I could understand when people want to have this offline
available.

Greetings
Bernd
-- 
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(OO)  When cryptography is outlawed, bayl bhgynjf jvyy unir cevinpl!

Re: gcc 3.3 - what problems should I expect?

[Marcelo E. Magallon]

On Tue, Jun 17, 2003 at 11:39:20PM +1000, Hamish Moffatt wrote:

 > How? It always fails to link for me.

 I have compiled 2.4.20 and 2.4.21 with gcc 3.3 (not Debian's) a couple
 of times now.  I only had trouble with i2c and lm-sensors, though.

 Marcelo

Re: gcc 3.3 - what problems should I expect?

[Bernd Eckenfels]

On Wed, Jun 18, 2003 at 08:22:51AM +0200, Marcelo E. Magallon wrote:
> On Tue, Jun 17, 2003 at 11:39:20PM +1000, Hamish Moffatt wrote:
>  > How? It always fails to link for me.

>  I have compiled 2.4.20 and 2.4.21 with gcc 3.3 (not Debian's) a couple
>  of times now.  I only had trouble with i2c and lm-sensors, though.

2.4.21 contains some fixes for linkage errors, which are created due to
extern _inline_ declarations. You just need to remove the extern modifier
and it will work for 2.4.20.

Greetings
Bernd
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Re: Bug#196800: flex mustn't assume stdint.h is available on allplatforms

[Manoj Srivastava]

On Mon, 16 Jun 2003 22:55:53 -0400, Neil Roeth <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said: 

> On Jun 13, Daniel Jacobowitz ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
>> On Fri, Jun 13, 2003 at 06:02:02PM -0500, Manoj Srivastava wrote:
>> > On Fri, 13 Jun 2003 18:20:37 -0400, Daniel Jacobowitz
>> > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said:
>> >
>> > > On Thu, Jun 12, 2003 at 08:40:47PM -0500, Manoj Srivastava
>> > > wrote:
>> > >> On Thu, 12 Jun 2003 15:22:17 -0400, Daniel Jacobowitz
>> > >> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said:
>> > >>
>> > >> >> You need to read up on your standards. The language called
>> > >> >> C is defined by only one authoritative standard.
>> > >> >> --
>> > >> >> ISO/IEC 9899:1999 (E) (C)ISO/IEC
>> > >> >>
>> > >> >> Contents ix
>> > >> >>
>> > >> >> 5 This second edition cancels and replaces the first
>> > >> >> edition, ISO/IEC 9899:1990, as amended and corrected by
>> > >> >> ISO/IEC 9899/COR1:1994, ISO/IEC 9899/AMD1:1995, and ISO
>> > >> >> /IEC 9899/COR2:1996.
>> > >> >>
>> > >> >> --
>> > >> >>
>> > >> >> Thus, I need have no such qualifiers when talking abouit
>> > >> >> conforming C implmentations.
>> > >>
>> > >> > Given the real-world deployment of probably at least a dozen
>> > >> > major OSs which were 9899:1990 conformant and predate the
>> > >> > 9899:1999 standard, I'd say that's a pretty useless point of
>> > >> > view.
>> > >>
>> > >> OOh, I am blinded by the cogency of your arguments.
>> > >>
>> > >> C99 is over 3 years old.
>> >
>> > > And still not fully implemented.  Unstable only switched to a
>> > > compiler with minimal C99 support some months ago.  GCC has no
>> > > roadmap for implementing the remaining C99 features so it may
>> > > be years before they are available on free operating systems.
>> >
>> >And? You seem to be implying (incorrectly), that flex requires
>> >  more of C99 than is already present in Debian and a post 2.95
>> >  gcc. The new flex has been compiled, and has all the test suites
>> >  succesfully compile, on all 11 architectures Debian supports.
>> >
>> > >> For ancient platforms, use flex-old.
>> > >>
>> > >> Anyway, you are certainly entitled to your opinion, and you
>> > >> can do whatever you want with your packages and your code.
>> >
>> > > I am somewhat distressed that the version of flex provided with
>> > > Debian (I am assuming from the discussion) will not be usable
>> > > for cross-platform development without constant care to use
>> > > flex-old instead.  We've finally persuaded binutils and GCC to
>> > > move into the era of C90 source.  I don't think we'll see C99
>> > > widely enough supported to write portable software using it
>> > > until 2008 at least.
>> >
>> >Again you raise a strawman. Flex comes with a plethora of
>> >  tests, and all the tests have always been passed. Flex works
>> >  with all 11 architectures that comprise debian (we have a
>> >  mysterious test failure on the most recent m68k run, though I
>> >  think it may have more to do with the new gcc there than
>> >  anything else).
>> >
>> >Now, if you have any concrete objections as to why flex does
>> >  not work in Debian, please feeel free to point them out. If you
>> >  merely want to grumble about how flex may not work until 2008,
>> >  without providing a basis for such grumplings, I am sure I can't
>> >  help you there.
>>
>> You have missed my point.  I am quite aware that flex-generated
>> lexers will continue to work on all Debian platforms.  But until
>> C99 is much more mature than it is today, many other significant
>> platforms will not have a C99-compatible compiler - even to the
>> degree of including .  Therefore Debian becomes more
>> awkward for cross-platform, portable development.  Not useless,
>> because of flex-old, but certainly more awkward; I will not be able
>> to build Debian packages which require a recent flex in the same
>> root in which I build cross-platform software.
>>
>> Certainly you have not broken Debian; but I maintain that this
>> short-sightedness does damage Debian's usefulness as a development
>> platform, for all those targets which many more practical
>> developers must support in order to do their jobs.

> I think this is an excellent point.  I can think of many times when
> I've done development work in Debian and ported the result to
> Solaris, IRIX or HPUX.  It is, of course, not a requirement for
> Debian that this be easy, but the easier it is, the more convincing
> the argument for integrating Debian into a mixed *nix environment,
> for everyone from developers to CIOs.

Fine. You can then still choose to use flex-old (of course,
 any C++ scanners you have shall fail to work with gcc 3.3, and even
 for C scanners all bets are off wrt new compilers). 


Or you can use the new flex, and get scanners that require
 conforming implementations.

Debian offers you the cjoice -- since the

new packages queue

[Aníbal Monsalve Salazar]

Is there a web page where I can see how my packages are progressing in
the new packages queue?

Re: new packages queue

[Pierre Machard]

On Wed, Jun 18, 2003 at 05:33:55PM +1000, Aníbal Monsalve Salazar wrote:
> Is there a web page where I can see how my packages are progressing in
> the new packages queue?

http://packages.qa.debian.org

Cheers,
-- 
Pierre Machard
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>  TuxFamily.org
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> techmag.info
+33(0)668 178 365http://migus.tuxfamily.org/gpg.txt
GPG: 1024D/23706F87 : B906 A53F 84E0 49B6 6CF7 82C2 B3A0 2D66 2370 6F87


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Re: new packages queue

[Aníbal Monsalve Salazar]

On Wed, Jun 18, 2003 at 10:04:59AM +0200, Pierre Machard wrote:
> On Wed, Jun 18, 2003 at 05:33:55PM +1000, Aníbal Monsalve Salazar wrote:
> > Is there a web page where I can see how my packages are progressing in
> > the new packages queue?
> 
> http://packages.qa.debian.org

I don't think http://packages.qa.debian.org is the answer as I have
tried it already.

I have a new package called fprobe and it's in the new package queue. It
was uploaded on 14 June as you can see from the message below.

Both http://packages.qa.debian.org/fprobe and the form at the above address
return:

  Error 404
  I'm sorry, the page that you asked doesn't exist :

  File does not exist: /org/packages.qa.debian.org/www/web/f/fprobe.html

On Sat, Jun 14, 2003 at 02:17:09AM -0400, Debian Installer wrote:
> Date: Sat, 14 Jun 2003 02:17:09 -0400
> From: Debian Installer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: fprobe_0.3-1_i386.changes is NEW
> Sender: Archive Administrator <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: Anibal Monsalve Salazar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Message-id: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> X-Katie: $Revision: 1.34 $
>
> (new) fprobe_0.3-1.diff.gz optional net
> (new) fprobe_0.3-1.dsc optional net
> (new) fprobe_0.3-1_i386.deb optional net
> This tool exports NetFlow V5 datagrams to a remote collector
>  This is a small NetFlow probe which will listen on a interface using
>  libpcap,
>  aggregate the traffic and export NetFlow V5 datagram to a remote
>  collector
>  for processing. A flow is identified by ip protocol, source ip,
>  source port,
>  destination ip, destination port. Right now only ethernet interfaces
>  are
>  supported. Support for more media types (tunnel, ppp etc) will be
>  added.
> (new) fprobe_0.3.orig.tar.gz optional net
> Changes: fprobe (0.3-1) unstable; urgency=low
>  .
>   * Initial Release (closes: #197250).
> Announcing to debian-devel-changes@lists.debian.org
> Closing bugs: 197250
>
>
> Your package contains new components which requires manual editing of
> the override file.  It is ok otherwise, so please be patient.  New
> packages are usually added to the override file about once a week.
>
> You may have gotten the distribution wrong.  You'll get warnings above
> if files already exist in other distributions.


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Re: new packages queue

[Pierre Machard]

On Wed, Jun 18, 2003 at 19:02 +1000, Aníbal Monsalve Salazar wrote:
> On Wed, Jun 18, 2003 at 10:04:59AM +0200, Pierre Machard wrote:
> > On Wed, Jun 18, 2003 at 05:33:55PM +1000, Aníbal Monsalve Salazar wrote:
> > > Is there a web page where I can see how my packages are progressing in
> > > the new packages queue?
> > 
> > http://packages.qa.debian.org
> 
> I don't think http://packages.qa.debian.org is the answer as I have
> tried it already.
> 
> I have a new package called fprobe and it's in the new package queue. It
> was uploaded on 14 June as you can see from the message below.
> 
> Both http://packages.qa.debian.org/fprobe and the form at the above address
> return:
> 
>   Error 404
>   I'm sorry, the page that you asked doesn't exist :
[...]
> > Your package contains new components which requires manual editing of
> > the override file.  It is ok otherwise, so please be patient.  New
> > packages are usually added to the override file about once a week.

Your package require a manual action in oder to enter into the pool.
That's why a progressing web page or something like that is not
available. 

Once your package get into debian, then you can have an overview of its 
status from packages.qa.debian.org


Cheers,
-- 
Pierre Machard
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>  TuxFamily.org
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> techmag.info
+33(0)668 178 365http://migus.tuxfamily.org/gpg.txt
GPG: 1024D/23706F87 : B906 A53F 84E0 49B6 6CF7 82C2 B3A0 2D66 2370 6F87


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Re: whereis libsensors1?

[Josip Rodin]

On Wed, Jun 18, 2003 at 12:26:18AM +0200, Rene Engelhard wrote:
> Is isn't in the Debian archive anymore for unstable..
> 
> $ madison libsensors1
> libsensors1 |2.6.3-5 |stable | i386
> libsensors1 |2.6.5-4 |   testing | i386
> 
> KDE needs to be recompiled (see e.g. #196370 to depend on the newer
> libsensors package)

Except that there _is_ no newer libsensors-dev package.

http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=197022&msg=4

-- 
 2. That which causes joy or happiness.

Re: new packages queue

[Colin Watson]

On Wed, Jun 18, 2003 at 05:33:55PM +1000, An?bal Monsalve Salazar wrote:
> Is there a web page where I can see how my packages are progressing in
> the new packages queue?

I'm afraid not. You said you only uploaded it four days ago; I wouldn't
be at all worried about anything less than a week.

-- 
Colin Watson  [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Re: new packages queue

[Aníbal Monsalve Salazar]

On Wed, Jun 18, 2003 at 11:11:56AM +0200, Pierre Machard wrote:
> Your package require a manual action in oder to enter into the pool.
> That's why a progressing web page or something like that is not
> available. 
> 
> Once your package get into debian, then you can have an overview of its 
> status from packages.qa.debian.org

I knew that. I was asking just in case that service was available.

Thanks anyway.


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Re: new packages queue

[Michael Banck]

On Wed, Jun 18, 2003 at 07:02:10PM +1000, Aníbal Monsalve Salazar wrote:
> I have a new package called fprobe and it's in the new package queue. It
> was uploaded on 14 June as you can see from the message below.

The NEW queue needs manual intervention, so it only gets processed every
now and then. Your package doesn't propagate through the queue, it just
gets installed or rejected eventually.

Don't worry and wait.


Michael

Re: no freshness dating inside Packages.gz

[Brian May]

On Wed, Jun 18, 2003 at 06:09:55AM +0800, Dan Jacobson wrote:
> Sure, "you don't need to know the date, as you are using sid and did
> apt-get update, you are assured it's the latest version".  Well, one
> doesn't need the maintainer field either etc.

Here is a good reason for wanting to know the date:

Caches like apt-proxy combined with out-of-date debian mirrors sometimes
work against you and give apt-get (and cache) a really old Packages.gz
file, that contains obsolete Packages.

It would be nice if there was some automatic way of determining that the
Packages.gz/Sources.gz files downloaded are in fact up-to-date, without
manually inspecting them.

(I am just worried that one day I will do a lot of packporting from
unstable to stable and suddenly realize all my backports were obsolete
before I even created them...).
-- 
Brian May <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

Re: Advice needed : Oracle and Debian Linux

[Antonio Pérez Pérez]

On Sun, Jun 15, 2003 at 01:05:13PM +0100, Steve Kemp wrote:
> On Sun, Jun 15, 2003 at 01:51:46PM +0200, Michael Meskes wrote:
> 
> > Oracle will refuse to give you any support unless you run redhat. They
> > do tell you privately that it works nicely on debian, but no official
> > support will be given.
> 
>   That's mostly true, they still certify SuSE Linux as well as RedHat.
> 
>   I run Oracle with support under SuSE 7.2, and have unsupported
>  installations running on Debian too - but not in a production
>  capacity.  I'd love to have Debian be a supported platform so that I
>  don't have to maintain two seperate distributions.

A "little" question from an user: 
What could Debian do to be supported by Oracle?
Is there any way to contact them and become a supported distribution?

Yes, I know that business are business but... :)

Greets,

--
Antonio Pérez Pérez  |[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.aditel.org/weblog/aperez  | [EMAIL PROTECTED]
// debian-tags: Desempaquetando el reemplazo de amor ...

Re: new packages queue

[Jose Carlos Garcia Sogo]

El día 18 jun 2003, Aníbal Monsalve Salazar escribía:
> On Wed, Jun 18, 2003 at 11:11:56AM +0200, Pierre Machard wrote:
> > Your package require a manual action in oder to enter into the pool.
> > That's why a progressing web page or something like that is not
> > available. 
> > 
> > Once your package get into debian, then you can have an overview of its 
> > status from packages.qa.debian.org
> 
> I knew that. I was asking just in case that service was available.

  When it's accepted to come in the archive, you'll receive a ACCEPTED
  mail from Katie telling you that, and you'll be able to see it in
  http://incoming.debian.org

  Having a page showing that isn't very important, as the only info you
  can show is the same you know yet: the package is in NEW or in
  ACCEPTED queues.

-- 
  Jose Carlos Garcia Sogo
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]


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Re: new packages queue

[Sven Luther]

On Wed, Jun 18, 2003 at 01:15:43PM +0200, Jose Carlos Garcia Sogo wrote:
> El día 18 jun 2003, Aníbal Monsalve Salazar escribía:
> > On Wed, Jun 18, 2003 at 11:11:56AM +0200, Pierre Machard wrote:
> > > Your package require a manual action in oder to enter into the pool.
> > > That's why a progressing web page or something like that is not
> > > available. 
> > > 
> > > Once your package get into debian, then you can have an overview of its 
> > > status from packages.qa.debian.org
> > 
> > I knew that. I was asking just in case that service was available.
> 
>   When it's accepted to come in the archive, you'll receive a ACCEPTED
>   mail from Katie telling you that, and you'll be able to see it in
>   http://incoming.debian.org
> 
>   Having a page showing that isn't very important, as the only info you
>   can show is the same you know yet: the package is in NEW or in
>   ACCEPTED queues.

What abou the size of the NEWs queue, and the relative position of your
package in it. To be usefull, this would imply that the ftp-masters
operate the NEW queue in fifo order, which may or may not be the case.

Waiting for a package to be accepted (or rejected) is a lengthy and/or
frustrating business, but as i understand there is no way around it.

Also, many packages go into the news queue while this is not really
necessary, for example, is it really necessary for a new soname version
of a library to wait in the news queue, when the previous version did
already be packaged ? Or the new kernel-source package ?

Friendly,

Sven Luther

Re: Advice needed : Oracle and Debian Linux

[Russell Coker]

On Wed, 18 Jun 2003 21:06, Antonio Pérez Pérez wrote:
> A "little" question from an user:
> What could Debian do to be supported by Oracle?
> Is there any way to contact them and become a supported distribution?

I am not aware of what might be necessary for this, but I imagine it to be 
similar to the requirements for SAP support.

Some time ago I spoke with a SAP employee who uses Debian for his own personal 
use about getting SAP support.  He told me that due to some German laws about 
liability for failures etc SAP is unwilling to support any distribution that 
is not commercial.  If a buggy kernel causes data loss then someone has to be 
held accountable, Debian can't and SAP is unwilling to take the 
responsibility themselves for what might happen when running their software 
on a kernel that they have not tested.  The kernels from ftp.kernel.org don't 
seem to meet the requirements for serious database use.

If a company wants to make a commercial distribution based on Debian then 
providing that they accept certain kernel patches and comply with a rigorous 
test program then I think that SAP would be interested in dealing with them.

I imagine that the situation will be similar for Oracle.

Lindows is not suitable for such things.  Are there any other Debian-based 
commercial distributions that are still going?

-- 
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http://www.coker.com.au/bonnie++/  Bonnie++ hard drive benchmark
http://www.coker.com.au/postal/Postal SMTP/POP benchmark
http://www.coker.com.au/~russell/  My home page

Bug#197904: ITP: rtai-doc -- real time application interface

[Edelhard Becker]

Package: wnpp
Version: unavailable; reported 2003-06-18
Severity: wishlist

* Package name: rtai
  Version : 24.1.11
  Upstream Author : RTAI development team <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
* URL : http://www.rtai.org/
* License : LGPL, (and still some) GPL
  Description : real time application interface

RTAI is a realtime extension with a broad variety of services which
make realtime programmers' lifes easier. Some of them are

 choose between FIFO and RR scheduling policies on a per task basis.
 extended POSIX APIs and message queues, in kernel and user space
 semaphores can be typed as: counting, binary and resource
 a mailbox implementation
 NEWLXRT for soft hard real time in user space

This package contains the documentation.

-- System Information:
Debian Release: testing/unstable
Architecture: i386
Kernel: Linux fram 2.4.20-adeos-686-smp #1 SMP Fri Apr 4 13:40:18 CEST 2003 i686
Locale: LANG=C, LC_CTYPE=de_DE

Bug#197902: ITP: rtai -- real time application interface

[Edelhard Becker]

Package: wnpp
Version: unavailable; reported 2003-06-18
Severity: wishlist

* Package name: rtai
  Version : 24.1.11
  Upstream Author : RTAI development team <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
* URL : http://www.rtai.org/
* License : LGPL, (and still some) GPL
  Description : real time application interface

RTAI is a realtime extension with a broad variety of services which
make realtime programmers' lifes easier. Some of them are

 choose between FIFO and RR scheduling policies on a per task basis.
 extended POSIX APIs and message queues, in kernel and user space
 semaphores can be typed as: counting, binary and resource
 a mailbox implementation
 NEWLXRT for soft hard real time in user space

This package contains the runtime modules.

-- System Information:
Debian Release: testing/unstable
Architecture: i386
Kernel: Linux fram 2.4.20-adeos-686-smp #1 SMP Fri Apr 4 13:40:18 CEST 2003 i686
Locale: LANG=C, LC_CTYPE=de_DE

Bug#197903: ITP: rtai-dev -- real time application interface

[Edelhard Becker]

Package: wnpp
Version: unavailable; reported 2003-06-18
Severity: wishlist

* Package name: rtai
  Version : 24.1.11
  Upstream Author : RTAI development team <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
* URL : http://www.rtai.org/
* License : LGPL, (and still some) GPL
  Description : real time application interface

RTAI is a realtime extension with a broad variety of services which
make realtime programmers' lifes easier. Some of them are

 choose between FIFO and RR scheduling policies on a per task basis.
 extended POSIX APIs and message queues, in kernel and user space
 semaphores can be typed as: counting, binary and resource
 a mailbox implementation
 NEWLXRT for soft hard real time in user space

This package contains the development files.

-- System Information:
Debian Release: testing/unstable
Architecture: i386
Kernel: Linux fram 2.4.20-adeos-686-smp #1 SMP Fri Apr 4 13:40:18 CEST 2003 i686
Locale: LANG=C, LC_CTYPE=de_DE

Bug#197901: ITP: kernel-patch-adeos -- ADEOS nanokernel for sharing hardware resources

[Edelhard Becker]

Package: wnpp
Version: unavailable; reported 2003-06-18
Severity: wishlist

* Package name: kernel-patch-adeos
  Version : 2.4r6
  Upstream Author : Philippe Gerum <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Karim Yaghmour <[EMAIL 
PROTECTED]>
* URL : http://www.nongnu.org/adeos/
* License : GPL
  Description : ADEOS nanokernel for sharing hardware resources

The purpose of Adeos is to provide a flexible environment for sharing
hardware resources among multiple operating systems, or among multiple
instances of a single OS.

The Adeos nanokernel is based on research and publications made in the
early '90s on the subject of nanokernels. Our basic method was to
reverse the approach described in most of the papers on the subject.
Instead of first building the nanokernel and then building the client
OSes, we started from a live and known-to-be-functional OS, Linux, and
inserted a nanokernel beneath it. Starting from Adeos, other client
OSes can now be put side-by-side with the Linux kernel.

-- System Information:
Debian Release: testing/unstable
Architecture: i386
Kernel: Linux fram 2.4.20-adeos-686-smp #1 SMP Fri Apr 4 13:40:18 CEST 2003 i686
Locale: LANG=C, LC_CTYPE=de_DE

Bug#197907: ITP: quark -- an audio player, for geeks, by geeks.

[Sven Luther]

Package: wnpp
Version: unavailable; reported 2003-06-18
Severity: wishlist

* Package name: quark
  Version : 3.0
  Upstream Author : Ben Jansens <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Scott Moynes <[EMAIL 
PROTECTED]>, Nick Jansens <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
* URL : http://quark.nerdnest.org/
* License : GPL
  Description : an audio player, for geeks, by geeks.

 Quark is an audio player, for geeks, by geeks. It runs in the
 background with access provided via a FIFO in the filesystem.
 It uses GStreamer for playing music, and can therefore play any
 file format supported by GStreamer.

 (Mmm, seems to be using Xine-Lib in its latest version though, so i
 will have to change this description).

-- System Information:
Debian Release: testing/unstable
Architecture: i386
Kernel: Linux iliana 2.4.21-pre5 #1 SMP ven jun 13 14:24:11 CEST 2003 i686
Locale: LANG=fr_FR.ISO-8859-1, LC_CTYPE=fr_FR.ISO-8859-1

Re: Bug#197907: ITP: quark -- an audio player, for geeks, by geeks.

[Stefano Zacchiroli]

On Wed, Jun 18, 2003 at 03:21:51PM +0200, Sven Luther wrote:
>  Quark is an audio player, for geeks, by geeks. It runs in the
>  background with access provided via a FIFO in the filesystem.
>  It uses GStreamer for playing music, and can therefore play any
>  file format supported by GStreamer.
> 
>  (Mmm, seems to be using Xine-Lib in its latest version though, so i
>  will have to change this description).

Why not using the description from the quark web site?:

   Quark is an audio player, for geeks, by geeks. It runs in the
   background with access provided via a FIFO in the filesystem. It uses
   Xine-lib for playing music, and can therefore play any file format
   supported by Xine.
   .
   Quark comes with a couple front-ends to make it more useful:
   * charm-quark - a CLI interface
   * strange-quark - a GTK System Tray interface

Cheers.

-- 
Stefano Zacchiroli  --  Master in Computer Science @ Uni. Bologna, Italy
[EMAIL PROTECTED],debian.org,bononia.it}  -  http://www.bononia.it/zack/
"  I know you believe you understood what you think I said, but I am not
sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant!  " -- G.Romney


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Re: Bug#197907: ITP: quark -- an audio player, for geeks, by geeks.

[Sven Luther]

On Wed, Jun 18, 2003 at 03:58:44PM +0200, Stefano Zacchiroli wrote:
> On Wed, Jun 18, 2003 at 03:21:51PM +0200, Sven Luther wrote:
> >  Quark is an audio player, for geeks, by geeks. It runs in the
> >  background with access provided via a FIFO in the filesystem.
> >  It uses GStreamer for playing music, and can therefore play any
> >  file format supported by GStreamer.
> > 
> >  (Mmm, seems to be using Xine-Lib in its latest version though, so i
> >  will have to change this description).
> 
> Why not using the description from the quark web site?:
> 
>Quark is an audio player, for geeks, by geeks. It runs in the
>background with access provided via a FIFO in the filesystem. It uses
>Xine-lib for playing music, and can therefore play any file format
>supported by Xine.
>.
>Quark comes with a couple front-ends to make it more useful:
>* charm-quark - a CLI interface
>* strange-quark - a GTK System Tray interface

Yep, i took the one from the Quark 3.0 announce, which i suppose was the
one of a previous version and should have been replaced by the one from
the web site.

Thanks, 

Friendly,

Sven Luther

Re: Bug#197907: ITP: quark -- an audio player, for geeks, by geeks.

[Sam Hocevar]

On Wed, Jun 18, 2003, Sven Luther wrote:

> Yep, i took the one from the Quark 3.0 announce, which i suppose was the
> one of a previous version and should have been replaced by the one from
> the web site.

   Also, you could remove the leading "an" from the short description,
as recommended by the developer's reference.

-- 
Sam.

Proposal: removing libc5, altgcc and all their old-days dependencies

[Francesco P. Lovergine]

Hi all

Someone could already know this amazing bug:

http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=196015

IMO it's a good moment to drop all the following i386-specific packages
which are libc5 related:

libc5
libc5-altdev
libc5-altdbg
altgcc
libdb1
libdb1-altdev
libdl1
libdl1-altdev
zlib1
ldso
libg++27-altdev
libregex0-altdev
svgalib1-altdev
xlib6-altdev
xpm4.7
xaw3d
netscape-base-4-libc5
svgalib1
svgalib-dummy1
termcap-compat

and others, partially.

This could impact potentially very old (commercial mostly) binaries,
Comments, ideas, complaints?

-- 
Francesco P. Lovergine

Re: Bug#197907: ITP: quark -- an audio player, for geeks, by geeks.

[Sven Luther]

On Wed, Jun 18, 2003 at 04:26:32PM +0200, Sam Hocevar wrote:
> On Wed, Jun 18, 2003, Sven Luther wrote:
> 
> > Yep, i took the one from the Quark 3.0 announce, which i suppose was the
> > one of a previous version and should have been replaced by the one from
> > the web site.
> 
>Also, you could remove the leading "an" from the short description,
> as recommended by the developer's reference.

Description: audio player, for geeks, by geeks.

Mmm, doesn't sound all that descriptive.

Friendly,

Sven Luther

Status of testing migration is improving

[Petter Reinholdtsen]

Some of you might remember my script to summarize the excuses list for
package migration from sid to testing.  I've posted it twice already.
The updated list is available from
http://developer.skolelinux.no/info/cdbygging/distdiff-all.html.gz>.

The situation is a lot better now then it was in april.  But there
seem to be some autobuild problems on m68k.  The newest stats are at
the top.

Statistics from update_excuses.html generated 2003.06.17 23:34:05 +.

  - 1462 packages total.
  - 1461 packages with differences.
  - 428 valid packages.
  - 345 buggy packages.
  - 950 packages over age.
  - 472 packages to young.
  - 32 packages marked for removal.
  - Archiectures missing packages: m68k(200) arm(155) alpha(133)
   s390(122) mips(115) ia64(113)
   mipsel(103) powerpc(95) sparc(91)
   hppa(68) i386(8)

Statistics from update_excuses.html generated 2003.04.21 23:32:16 +.

  - 2274 packages total.
  - 2269 packages with differences.
  - 1106 valid packages.
  - 365 buggy packages.
  - 1634 packages over age.
  - 570 packages to young.
  - 48 packages marked for removal.
  - Archiectures missing packages: arm(216) m68k(186) alpha(172)
   hppa(145) ia64(128) s390(123)
   powerpc(115) sparc(115) mips(115)
   mipsel(102) i386(6)

Statistics from update_excuses.html generated 2003.04.09

  - 2164 packages total.
  - 2148 packages with differences.
  - 1020 valid packages.
  - 372 buggy packages.
  - 1549 packages over age.
  - 533 packages to young.
  - 46 packages marked for removal.
  - Archiectures missing packages: arm(210) alpha(186) m68k(177)
   hppa(150) mips(144) ia64(139)
   powerpc(126) s390(123) sparc(120)
   mipsel(112) i386(6)

Re: Bug#197907: ITP: quark -- an audio player, for geeks, by geeks.

[Steve Langasek]

On Wed, Jun 18, 2003 at 04:37:09PM +0200, Sven Luther wrote:
> On Wed, Jun 18, 2003 at 04:26:32PM +0200, Sam Hocevar wrote:
> > On Wed, Jun 18, 2003, Sven Luther wrote:
> > 
> > > Yep, i took the one from the Quark 3.0 announce, which i suppose was the
> > > one of a previous version and should have been replaced by the one from
> > > the web site.
> > 
> >Also, you could remove the leading "an" from the short description,
> > as recommended by the developer's reference.

> Description: audio player, for geeks, by geeks.

> Mmm, doesn't sound all that descriptive.

Ugh.  Since when does the developer's reference recommend this?  The
article most definitely belongs...

-- 
Steve Langasek
postmodern programmer


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Re: Bug#197907: ITP: quark -- an audio player, for geeks, by geeks.

[Sam Hocevar]

On Wed, Jun 18, 2003, Steve Langasek wrote:

> Ugh.  Since when does the developer's reference recommend this?  The
> article most definitely belongs...

   It is in 6.2.2:

   Since the synopsis is a clause, rather than a
 full sentence, we recommend that it neither start with a capital nor
 end with a full stop (period).  It should also not begin with an
 article, either definite ("the") or indefinite ("a" or "an").

 It might help to imagine that the synopsis is combined with the
 package name in the following way:

   is a .

Cheers,
-- 
Sam.

Re: Bug#197907: ITP: quark -- an audio player, for geeks, by geeks.

[Stefano Zacchiroli]

On Wed, Jun 18, 2003 at 04:37:09PM +0200, Sven Luther wrote:
> >Also, you could remove the leading "an" from the short description,
> > as recommended by the developer's reference.
> Description: audio player, for geeks, by geeks.

It surely doesn't depend on the absence of the heading "an" :-)

Cheers.

-- 
Stefano Zacchiroli  --  Master in Computer Science @ Uni. Bologna, Italy
[EMAIL PROTECTED],debian.org,bononia.it}  -  http://www.bononia.it/zack/
"  I know you believe you understood what you think I said, but I am not
sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant!  " -- G.Romney


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Re: Bug#197907: ITP: quark -- an audio player, for geeks, by geeks.

[Thomas Viehmann]

Hi.

Sven Luther wrote:
>>   Also, you could remove the leading "an" from the short description,
>>as recommended by the developer's reference.
> Description: audio player, for geeks, by geeks.
> Mmm, doesn't sound all that descriptive.
But hardly because of the removal of the "an".
(i.e. what business has "by geeks for geeks" rather than something informative
in the short description?)

Cheers

T.


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Re: Bug#197907: ITP: quark -- an audio player, for geeks, by geeks.

[Steve Langasek]

On Wed, Jun 18, 2003 at 05:39:40PM +0200, Sam Hocevar wrote:
> On Wed, Jun 18, 2003, Steve Langasek wrote:

> > Ugh.  Since when does the developer's reference recommend this?  The
> > article most definitely belongs...

>It is in 6.2.2:
> 
>Since the synopsis is a clause, rather than a
>  full sentence, we recommend that it neither start with a capital nor
>  end with a full stop (period).  It should also not begin with an
>  article, either definite ("the") or indefinite ("a" or "an").
> 
>  It might help to imagine that the synopsis is combined with the
>  package name in the following way:

>is a .

Grammatically, the article is part of the clause.  This recommendation
is inconsistent.

-- 
Steve Langasek
postmodern programmer


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Re: Bug#197902: ITP: rtai -- real time application interface

[Branden Robinson]

On Wed, Jun 18, 2003 at 02:55:43PM +0200, Edelhard Becker wrote:
> RTAI is a realtime extension with a broad variety of services which
> make realtime programmers' lifes easier. Some of them are

The plural of "life" is "lives".

You may wish to run your package descriptions by the debian-l10n-english
list before releasing them to unstable.

-- 
G. Branden Robinson|If you make people think they're
Debian GNU/Linux   |thinking, they'll love you; but if
[EMAIL PROTECTED] |you really make them think, they'll
http://people.debian.org/~branden/ |hate you.


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Re: Bug#197907: ITP: quark -- an audio player, for geeks, by geeks.

[Branden Robinson]

On Wed, Jun 18, 2003 at 10:12:13AM -0500, Steve Langasek wrote:
> On Wed, Jun 18, 2003 at 04:37:09PM +0200, Sven Luther wrote:
> > On Wed, Jun 18, 2003 at 04:26:32PM +0200, Sam Hocevar wrote:
> > Description: audio player, for geeks, by geeks.
> 
> > Mmm, doesn't sound all that descriptive.
> 
> Ugh.  Since when does the developer's reference recommend this?  The
> article most definitely belongs...

It doesn't.  The period at the end doesn't belong either, and neither
does the first comma.

Description: audio player for geeks, by geeks

...is just right.

-- 
G. Branden Robinson|  You live and learn.
Debian GNU/Linux   |  Or you don't live long.
[EMAIL PROTECTED] |  -- Robert Heinlein
http://people.debian.org/~branden/ |


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Re: Bug#197907: ITP: quark -- an audio player, for geeks, by geeks.

[Sven Luther]

On Wed, Jun 18, 2003 at 05:46:44PM +0200, Thomas Viehmann wrote:
> Hi.
> 
> Sven Luther wrote:
> >>   Also, you could remove the leading "an" from the short description,
> >>as recommended by the developer's reference.
> > Description: audio player, for geeks, by geeks.
> > Mmm, doesn't sound all that descriptive.
> But hardly because of the removal of the "an".
> (i.e. what business has "by geeks for geeks" rather than something informative
> in the short description?)

I just copied what they claimed on the announcement, am still searching
for something better though.

Friendly,

Sven Luther

Re: Proposal: removing libc5, altgcc and all their old-days dependencies

[Fabio Massimo Di Nitto]

On Wed, 18 Jun 2003, Francesco P. Lovergine wrote:

> IMO it's a good moment to drop all the following i386-specific packages
> which are libc5 related:
>

[SNIP]

>
> and others, partially.
>
> This could impact potentially very old (commercial mostly) binaries,
> Comments, ideas, complaints?

I agree with this removal. I don't really see any reason to keep such old
pieces of software anymore (specially when they don't work properly
anymore or it looks like)

Fabio

-- 
Our mission: make IPv6 the default IP protocol
"We are on a mission from God" - Elwood Blues

http://www.itojun.org/paper/itojun-nanog-200210-ipv6isp/mgp4.html

Re: Bug#197907: ITP: quark -- an audio player, for geeks, by geeks.

[Emile van Bergen]

Hi,

On Wed, Jun 18, 2003 at 10:54:11AM -0500, Steve Langasek wrote:

> On Wed, Jun 18, 2003 at 05:39:40PM +0200, Sam Hocevar wrote:
> > On Wed, Jun 18, 2003, Steve Langasek wrote:
> 
> > > Ugh.  Since when does the developer's reference recommend this?  The
> > > article most definitely belongs...
> 
> >It is in 6.2.2:
> > 
> >Since the synopsis is a clause, rather than a
> >  full sentence, we recommend that it neither start with a capital nor
> >  end with a full stop (period).  It should also not begin with an
> >  article, either definite ("the") or indefinite ("a" or "an").
> > 
> >  It might help to imagine that the synopsis is combined with the
> >  package name in the following way:
> 
> >is a .
> 
> Grammatically, the article is part of the clause.  This recommendation
> is inconsistent.

"Since the synopsis is part of a clause..." would probably be better,
sure.

Also, " contains " could be suggested as a
template, see descriptions such as "header files for package xyz" or
"ABC support files", "development files", "KDE core applications", etc.

But in any case, no article seems to be the norm:

$ grep '^Description:' /var/lib/dpkg/available | wc -l
   9025
$ grep '^Description: [Aa][n ]' /var/lib/dpkg/available | wc -l
   1163

at least on woody, with just a few small extra repositories. The
lowercase recommendation seems much less followed:

$ grep '^Description: [A-Z]' /var/lib/dpkg/available | wc -l
   7661
$ grep '^Description: [a-z]' /var/lib/dpkg/available | wc -l
   1262

Cheers,


Emile.

-- 
E-Advies - Emile van Bergen   [EMAIL PROTECTED]  
tel. +31 (0)70 3906153   http://www.e-advies.nl

Re: Bug#197907: ITP: quark -- an audio player, for geeks, by geeks.

[Anthony DeRobertis]

On Wednesday, Jun 18, 2003, at 11:59 US/Eastern, Branden Robinson wrote:
Description: audio player for geeks, by geeks
...is just right.
Well, except that it doesn't actually describe the package well. Maybe 
insert "FIFO controlled" before "audio player."

Re: Bug#197907: ITP: quark -- an audio player, for geeks, by geeks.

[Josip Rodin]

On Wed, Jun 18, 2003 at 04:26:32PM +0200, Sam Hocevar wrote:
> > Yep, i took the one from the Quark 3.0 announce, which i suppose was the
> > one of a previous version and should have been replaced by the one from
> > the web site.
> 
>Also, you could remove the leading "an" from the short description,
> as recommended by the developer's reference.

Of all the things that were wrong with that short description, you had to
comment on the most contentious one! :)

-- 
 2. That which causes joy or happiness.

Re: Fun with python-apt

[Anthony DeRobertis]

On Tuesday, Jun 17, 2003, at 10:50 US/Eastern, Bernd Eckenfels wrote:
On Tue, Jun 17, 2003 at 10:22:54AM -0400, Anthony DeRobertis wrote:
Yep. That's the point of my proposal. They would be. When you changed 
a
package to use the new c103 (or whatever the next ABI is), you'd 
change
the library dependencies to the c103 versions.
This will work, but it will stop the ability to rebuild the packages 
and
migrate thereby to a new API.
Not really. Packages already had to be manually rebuilt[0] for the 
current transition. There is no reason that a simple change of
	s/CXX=g++-c102/CXX=g++-c103/
couldn't be done at the same time.

OTOH, accidental ABI migrations leading to, depending on the ABI 
change, anything from instability/data corruption/etc. to dynamic 
linking failure, will be avoided.

How about dh_shlibdeps, is it detecting this (and failing?). Hmm.. 
actually
I think this was not the problem in the current example.
That makes the problem a little more obvious, but it doesn't solve it.
[0] http://people.debian.org/~rmurray/c++transition.html

Re: Proposal: removing libc5, altgcc and all their old-days dependencies

[Mark Brown]

On Wed, Jun 18, 2003 at 04:17:43PM +0200, Francesco P. Lovergine wrote:

> IMO it's a good moment to drop all the following i386-specific packages
> which are libc5 related:

> zlib1

This is going to vanish shortly anyway unless the libc5 bug is fixed
since it breaks zlib builds.  I'd only been continuing to build libc5
packages on the basis that it was no bother to continue doing so.

-- 
"You grabbed my hand and we fell into it, like a daydream - or a fever."


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Re: Proposal: removing libc5, altgcc and all their old-days dependencies

[Daniel Schepler]

"Francesco P. Lovergine" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

> Someone could already know this amazing bug:
>
> http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=196015

I've seen this before; it seems that sometimes when the package is
built from source, the resulting library is missing some symbols for
some reason.  AFAICT, this happens completely at random (i.e. if I use
pbuilder twice on the package, it might be broken one time and fine
the next).

> IMO it's a good moment to drop all the following i386-specific packages
> which are libc5 related:

I agree, especially considering that ldso can't be built from source
because of bug #168592.
-- 
Daniel Schepler  "Please don't disillusion me.  I
[EMAIL PROTECTED]haven't had breakfast yet."
 -- Orson Scott Card

Re: Security procedures

[Matt Zimmerman]

On Tue, Jun 17, 2003 at 08:25:44PM -0400, Joey Hess wrote:

> I just want to thank the security team for doing such a stellar job
> lately, with both the enormous kernel fixes, and the constant stream of
> advisories on other packages. Though I kinda hope that will taper off
> sometime, or we're going to look bad on the security issues per year
> metrics..

If folks pay attention to that kind of metric, I hope they take into account
that Debian ships quite a lot more software than, well, anyone.

-- 
 - mdz

fcntl(HANDLE, F_GETLK,&fl) with perl

[Bill Allombert]

Hello Debian-devel,

I try to code the following in perl

  struct flock fl;
  if (fcntl(fd,F_GETLK,&fl) == -1)

to query the dpkg lock.

I have tried the above 

fcntl DPKG_LOCKFILE,F_GETLK, \%fl;

but it does not seems to work. In fact the documentation
is unclear whether a struct flock can be passed at all
(some form of fcntl use a long arg instead).

Any idea ? [please CC me]

Cheers,
-- 
Bill. <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

Imagine a large red swirl here. 

Re: Bug#197907: ITP: quark -- an audio player, for geeks, by geeks.

[Branden Robinson]

On Wed, Jun 18, 2003 at 12:31:52PM -0400, Anthony DeRobertis wrote:
> On Wednesday, Jun 18, 2003, at 11:59 US/Eastern, Branden Robinson wrote:
> >Description: audio player for geeks, by geeks
> >
> >...is just right.
> 
> Well, except that it doesn't actually describe the package well. Maybe 
> insert "FIFO controlled" before "audio player."

True enough, but I've long hence given up trying to persuade people to
make their package descriptions useful.  They'd much rather be cute,
clever, and opaque.

-- 
G. Branden Robinson|  You live and learn.
Debian GNU/Linux   |  Or you don't live long.
[EMAIL PROTECTED] |  -- Robert Heinlein
http://people.debian.org/~branden/ |


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How to ask Upstream for clarification of "under the same terms as Perl itself" license

[Marc Haber]

Hi,

I have just had a package rejected by ftpmaster because the copyright
file contained
|This program is free software; you can redistribute it and/or
|modify it under the same terms as Perl itself. See
|/usr/share/common-licenses and /usr/share/doc/perl/copyright.

ftpmaster basically says that this cannot get into Debian until
Upstream has clarified the license which is at the moment unacceptable
for Debian.

This must be a new thing since 10 % of the lib*-perl Packages on my
reference system have that reference to "the same terms as Perl
itself", and since this mistake is so common, I am pretty sure that
some of you have a boilerplate message for the Upstream authors in
hand to ask them for clarification of their license.

May I ask people to share these messages so that I can use them to ask
Upstream? If I word them myself, I probably couldn't avoid some
asr-style kind of biting sarcasm which probably wouldn't make Debian
look very good.

Greetings
Marc, slowly tired of jumping though hoops to get packages accepted

-- 
-- !! No courtesy copies, please !! -
Marc Haber  |   " Questions are the | Mailadresse im Header
Karlsruhe, Germany  | Beginning of Wisdom " | Fon: *49 721 966 32 15
Nordisch by Nature  | Lt. Worf, TNG "Rightful Heir" | Fax: *49 721 966 31 29

Re: How to ask Upstream for clarification of "under the same terms as Perl itself" license

[Don Armstrong]

On Wed, 18 Jun 2003, Marc Haber wrote:
> I have just had a package rejected by ftpmaster because the copyright
> file contained 

> |This program is free software; you can redistribute it and/or
> |modify it under the same terms as Perl itself. See
> |/usr/share/common-licenses and /usr/share/doc/perl/copyright.

First off, your copyright file needs to reference the Copyright and
the licenses themselves, eg:

  Copyright: Copyright (C) - Foolish Barnone. All rights
  reserved. This program is free software; you can redistribute it
  and/or modify it under the same terms as Perl itself.

   License: GPL, Artistic, available at 
/usr/share/common-licenses/{GPL,Artistic}

> ftpmaster basically says that this cannot get into Debian until
> Upstream has clarified the license which is at the moment
> unacceptable for Debian.

From the long -legal thread[1], many acknowledged this as a possible
problem, and recommended where possible that upstreams be made aware
of the flexibility of interpretation of the perl style
copyright/licensing clause.

However, I'm not aware of ftpmasters beginning to reject perl packages
solely because of this problem... so reread your reject message
carefully, then read James Troup's more detailed explanation.[2].


Don Armstrong

1: http://lists.debian.org/debian-legal/2003/debian-legal-200302/msg00039.html
2: http://lists.debian.org/debian-perl/2003/debian-perl-200302/msg8.html
-- 
My spelling ability, or rather the lack thereof, is one of the wonders
of the modern world.

http://www.donarmstrong.com
http://www.anylevel.com
http://rzlab.ucr.edu


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Re: fcntl(HANDLE, F_GETLK,&fl) with perl

[Philippe Troin]

Bill Allombert <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

> Hello Debian-devel,
> 
> I try to code the following in perl
> 
>   struct flock fl;
>   if (fcntl(fd,F_GETLK,&fl) == -1)
> 
> to query the dpkg lock.
> 
> I have tried the above 
> 
> fcntl DPKG_LOCKFILE,F_GETLK, \%fl;
> 
> but it does not seems to work. In fact the documentation
> is unclear whether a struct flock can be passed at all
> (some form of fcntl use a long arg instead).

You have to pack the structure by hand. This works for me:

  use Config;
  my $packspec = $Config{uselargefiles} ? "ssqql" : "sslll";
  my $lk = "";
  fcntl DPKG_LOCKFILE,F_GETLK,$lk;
  my ($l_type, $l_whence, $l_start, $l_len, $l_pid) = unpack($packspec, $lk);

Phil.

Re: How to ask Upstream for clarification of "under the same terms as Perl itself" license

[Russ Allbery]

Don Armstrong <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

> From the long -legal thread[1], many acknowledged this as a possible
> problem, and recommended where possible that upstreams be made aware of
> the flexibility of interpretation of the perl style copyright/licensing
> clause.

I'm one of the maintainers of the Perl documentation which recommends a
licensing clause.  That documentation currently reads:

   COPYRIGHT AND LICENSE

   For copyright

   Copyright YEAR(s) by YOUR NAME(s)

   (No, (C) is not needed.  No, "all rights reserved" is not needed.)

   For licensing the easiest way is to use the same licensing as Perl
   itself:

   This library is free software; you may redistribute it and/or
   modify it under the same terms as Perl itself.

   This makes it easy for people to use your module with Perl.  Note
   that this licensing is neither an endorsement or a requirement, you
   are of course free to choose any licensing.

I apologize for not having time for reviewing a long thread right now, but
if someone can recommend alternate wording that would preserve the same
spirit but avoid the potential problems that you've seen, or alternately
something that I can add that explains those potential problems for module
authors, I'd be very happy to update this text.

Is the concern the lack of specificity about the version of Perl and
therefore the exact license referred to?

-- 
Russ Allbery ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) 

not modified modifications

[Bernd Eckenfels]

Hello,

I must admit, I am pretty annoyed with TeX on my system, because I simply do
not need it, and more and more packages depend on it.

But I have chosen to ignore this problem, which is not that easy, because
ever so often I get an update of all those zillion tex related packages,
which is survive.

But currently I am quite annoyed about all those questions I got asked.
Especially stuff like this:

Configuration file /etc/texmf/texmf.d/05TeXMF.cnf'
 ==> File on system created by you or by a script.
 ==> File also in package provided by package maintainer.
   What would you like to do about it ?  Your options are:
Y or I  : install the package maintainer's version
N or O  : keep your currently-installed version
  D : show the differences between the versions
  Z : background this process to examine the situation
 The default action is to keep your current version.
*** 05TeXMF.cnf (Y/I/N/O/D/Z) [default=N] ? d
--- /etc/texmf/texmf.d/05TeXMF.cnf  2002-09-07 10:08:19.0 +0200
+++ /etc/texmf/texmf.d/05TeXMF.cnf.dpkg-new 2003-06-01
11:33:39.0 +02
00
@@ -70,11 +70,12 @@

 % Now, list all the texmf trees. If you have multiple trees you can
 % use shell brace notation, like this:
-TEXMF = {$HOMETEXMF,$TEXMFLOCAL,$TEXMFOLDLOCAL,!!$TEXMFMAIN}
+% TEXMF = {$HOMETEXMF,!!$TEXMFLOCAL,!!$TEXMFMAIN}
 % The braces are necessary.  If you set VARTEXMF, you also have to
 %   - list $VARTEXMF in the TEXMF definition;
 %   - make sure that $VARTEXMF precedes $TEXMFMAIN in the TEXMF definition.
 % TEXMF = $TEXMFMAIN
+TEXMF = {$HOMETEXMF,$TEXMFLOCAL,$TEXMFOLDLOCAL,!!$TEXMFMAIN}

 % The system trees.  These are the trees that are shared by all the users.
 SYSTEXMF = $TEXMFLOCAL;$TEXMFOLDLOCAL;$TEXMFMAIN

i am very sure, I did never have touched this file, so why is dpkg always
asking me if i want to overwrite it? IS this a dpkg problem, is it a
packaging problem, or is is a script which is modifying those files?

some more:

--- /etc/texmf/texmf.d/45TeXinputs.cnf  2002-03-25 13:14:04.0 +0100
+++ /etc/texmf/texmf.d/45TeXinputs.cnf.dpkg-new 2003-06-01
11:33:39.0 +02
00
@@ -30,6 +30,7 @@
 TEXINPUTS.pdfmex   = .;$TEXMF/{pdftex,tex}/{mex,plain,generic,}//
 TEXINPUTS.pdftex   = .;$TEXMF/{pdftex,tex}/{plain,generic,}//
 TEXINPUTS.pdftexinfo = .;$TEXMF/{pdftex,tex}/{texinfo,plain,generic,}//
+TEXINPUTS.pdfamstex = .;$TEXMF/{pdftex,tex}/{amstex,plain,generic,}//

 % pdfeTeX.
 TEXINPUTS.pdfelatex = .;$TEXMF/{pdfetex,pdftex,etex,tex}/{latex,generic,}//
@@ -50,7 +51,7 @@
 TEXINPUTS.pdfplatex = .;$TEXMF/{pdftex,tex}/{platex,latex,generic,}//
 TEXINPUTS.pdfmex-pl = .;$TEXMF/{pdftex,tex}/{mex,plain,generic,}//
 TEXINPUTS.pdfemex   =
.;$TEXMF/{pdfetex,pdftex,etex,tex}/{mex,plain,generic,}//
-TEXINPUTS.pdfemex-pl =
.;$TEXMF/{pdfetex,pdftex,etex,tex}/{mex,plain,generic,
+TEXINPUTS.pdfemex-pl =
.;$TEXMF/{pdfetex,pdftex,etex,tex}/{mex,plain,generic,}//

 % Earlier entries override later ones, so put this last.
 TEXINPUTS = .;$TEXMF/tex/{generic,}//


--- /etc/texmf/texmf.d/75DviPS.cnf  2002-03-25 13:14:04.0 +0100
+++ /etc/texmf/texmf.d/75DviPS.cnf.dpkg-new 2003-06-01
11:33:39.0 +02
00
@@ -1,5 +1,6 @@
 % PostScript headers, prologues (.pro), encodings (.enc) and fonts.
 TEXPSHEADERS = .;$TEXMF/{dvips,pdftex,tex,fonts/type1}//
+TEXPSHEADERS.gsftopk = .;$TEXMF/{dvips,pdftex,tex,fonts/{type1,truetype}}//

 % PostScript Type 1 outline fonts.
 T1FONTS = .;$TEXMF/fonts/type1//;$TEXMF/fonts/hbf//
@@ -14,5 +15,5 @@
 T42FONTS = .;$TEXMF/fonts/type42//

 % Dvips' config.* files (this name should not start with EX'!).
-TEXCONFIG = .;$TEXMF/dvips//
+TEXCONFIG = $TEXMF/dvips//



--- /etc/texmf/texmf.d/85Misc.cnf   2002-09-07 10:08:19.0 +0200
+++ /etc/texmf/texmf.d/85Misc.cnf.dpkg-new  2003-06-01
11:33:39.0 +02
00
@@ -35,11 +35,12 @@
 % search formats, you'll want to add their variables here as well.
 T4HTINPUTS   = .;$TEXMF/tex4ht//

-% xdvik with type1 support can share some files with dvips
-XDVIINPUTS = .;$TEXMF/{xdvi,dvips//}
+% xdvik and dvipdfm can share some files with dvips
+XDVIINPUTS = .;$TEXMF/{xdvi,dvips}//
+DVIPDFMINPUTS = .;$TEXMF/{dvipdfm,dvips}//

 %% The mktex* scripts rely on KPSE_DOT. Do not set it in the environment.
-KPSE_DOT = .
+% KPSE_DOT = .

 % This definition isn't used from this .cnf file itself (that would be
 % paradoxical), but the compile-time default in paths.h is built from it.


--- /etc/texmf/texmf.d/95NonPath.cnf2002-03-25 13:14:04.0 +0100
+++ /etc/texmf/texmf.d/95NonPath.cnf.dpkg-new   2003-06-01
11:33:39.0 +0200
@@ -28,13 +28,7 @@

 % Allow TeX, MF, and MP to parse the first line of an input file for
 % the %&format construct.
-parse_first_line = t
...


... now i am waiting on inittex to finish *feels even more bothered* 

Greetings
Bernd
-- 
  (OO)  -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] --
 ( .. )  [EMAIL PROTECTED],linux.de,debian.org} http://home.pages.de/~eckes/
  o--o *plush*  2048/93600EFD  [EM

Re: Bug#197907: ITP: quark -- an audio player, for geeks, by geeks.

[Steve Langasek]

On Wed, Jun 18, 2003 at 06:25:20PM +0200, Emile van Bergen wrote:

> On Wed, Jun 18, 2003 at 10:54:11AM -0500, Steve Langasek wrote:

> > On Wed, Jun 18, 2003 at 05:39:40PM +0200, Sam Hocevar wrote:
> > > On Wed, Jun 18, 2003, Steve Langasek wrote:

> > > > Ugh.  Since when does the developer's reference recommend this?  The
> > > > article most definitely belongs...

> > >It is in 6.2.2:
> > > 
> > >Since the synopsis is a clause, rather than a
> > >  full sentence, we recommend that it neither start with a capital nor
> > >  end with a full stop (period).  It should also not begin with an
> > >  article, either definite ("the") or indefinite ("a" or "an").
> > > 
> > >  It might help to imagine that the synopsis is combined with the
> > >  package name in the following way:
> > 
> > >is a .

> > Grammatically, the article is part of the clause.  This recommendation
> > is inconsistent.

> "Since the synopsis is part of a clause..." would probably be better,
> sure.

That would make the recommendation almost entirely meaningless.  Nearly
all incorrect short descriptions are parts of a clause of one sort or
another.

> Also, " contains " could be suggested as a
> template, see descriptions such as "header files for package xyz" or
> "ABC support files", "development files", "KDE core applications", etc.

Precisely.  Such a template requires that the provided synopsis be a
noun clause.  If descriptions are all to be kept on equal footing
grammatically (which makes for greatest comprehensibility), then both
" is ." and " contains ."
should require complete noun phrases/clauses for the short desc.

> But in any case, no article seems to be the norm:

> $ grep '^Description:' /var/lib/dpkg/available | wc -l
>9025
> $ grep '^Description: [Aa][n ]' /var/lib/dpkg/available | wc -l
>1163

> at least on woody, with just a few small extra repositories.

Not all short descriptions would be grammatically correct with a leading
indefinite article; which is why, where it's appropriate, it should be
explicit.

> The lowercase recommendation seems much less followed:

> $ grep '^Description: [A-Z]' /var/lib/dpkg/available | wc -l
>7661
> $ grep '^Description: [a-z]' /var/lib/dpkg/available | wc -l
>1262

Unfortunate, since /that/ recommendation is sound :)

-- 
Steve Langasek
postmodern programmer


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Re: Proposal: removing libc5, altgcc and all their old-days dependencies

[Philip Charles]

xpm4.7 is needed for WordPerfect 8.  I have a mass of wp5.1 and wp8
documents.

Phil.

On Wed, 18 Jun 2003, Francesco P. Lovergine wrote:

>
> Hi all
>
> Someone could already know this amazing bug:
>
> http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=196015
>
> IMO it's a good moment to drop all the following i386-specific packages
> which are libc5 related:
>
> libc5
> libc5-altdev
> libc5-altdbg
> altgcc
> libdb1
> libdb1-altdev
> libdl1
> libdl1-altdev
> zlib1
> ldso
> libg++27-altdev
> libregex0-altdev
> svgalib1-altdev
> xlib6-altdev
> xpm4.7
> xaw3d
> netscape-base-4-libc5
> svgalib1
> svgalib-dummy1
> termcap-compat
>
> and others, partially.
>
> This could impact potentially very old (commercial mostly) binaries,
> Comments, ideas, complaints?
>
> --
> Francesco P. Lovergine
>
>
> --
> To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>
>

--
  Philip Charles; 39a Paterson Street, Abbotsford, Dunedin, New Zealand
   +64 3 488 2818Fax +64 3 488 2875Mobile 025 267 9420
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] - preferred.  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 I sell GNU/Linux & GNU/Hurd CDs.   See http://www.copyleft.co.nz

Re: How to ask Upstream for clarification of "under the same terms as Perl itself" license

[Don Armstrong]

[Setting followup to -legal]

On Wed, 18 Jun 2003, Russ Allbery wrote:
> but if someone can recommend alternate wording that would preserve
> the same spirit but avoid the potential problems that you've seen, or
> alternately something that I can add that explains those potential
> problems for module authors, I'd be very happy to update this text.

There are two methods you can use to clean up the clause:

   Copyright (C) - Foolish Barnone. All rights reserved. This
   program is free software; you can redistribute it and/or modify it
   under the same terms as Perl itself, version ZZ.YY or any later
   version at your option.

Or:

  Copyright Year, Your Name Here. All rights reserved.

  This program is free software; you can redistribute it and/or modify
  it under the terms of either:

   a) the GNU General Public License as published by the Free Software
  Foundation; either version 1, or (at your option) any later
  version, or

   b) the "Artistic License" which comes with Perl.   

This latter is the current copyright statement of Perl itself. You may
wish to specify GPL v2 instead. Note as well that I haven't received
much criticism either way over the proposed copyright statements, so
please scrutinize them before using them.

There was a discussion on perlmonks a few months back about it when it
came up in -legal.[1]

> Is the concern the lack of specificity about the version of Perl and
> therefore the exact license referred to?

That, and the fact that the license could potentially be a moving
target. (For a more detailed explanation, you have to read the -legal
thread.)


Don Armstrong

1: http://www.perlmonks.org/index.pl?node_id=232693
-- 
We were at a chinese resturant.
He was yelling at the waitress because there was a typo in his fortune
cookie.
 -- hugh macleod http://www.gapingvoid.com/batch31.php

http://www.donarmstrong.com
http://www.anylevel.com
http://rzlab.ucr.edu


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Re: Bug#197907: ITP: quark -- an audio player, for geeks, by geeks.

[Vineet Kumar]

* Anthony DeRobertis ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) [030618 10:11]:
> 
> On Wednesday, Jun 18, 2003, at 11:59 US/Eastern, Branden Robinson wrote:
> 
> >
> >Description: audio player for geeks, by geeks
> >
> >...is just right.
> 
> Well, except that it doesn't actually describe the package well. Maybe 
> insert "FIFO controlled" before "audio player."

Or better, "FIFO-controlled", so it doesn't read like a past-tense
sentence fragment about FIFO having controlled an audio player.

good times,
Vineet
-- 
http://www.doorstop.net/
-- 
"If we do not believe in freedom of speech for those we despise we do not
believe in it at all."  --Noam Chomsky


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Description: Digital signature

Bug in test suite for pcre 4.3

[Mark Baker]

Andreas Metzler wrote:
Mark has uploaded it yesterday in the evening. The bad news is that
4.3 seems to be broken on m68k, ia64 and alpha, "make test" fails.
I do not believe it is actually broken, at least not on alpha; I'm 
assuming the problems on the other architectures are similar.

It does not look like a compiler/packaging related issue, I've
doublechecked on escher (alpha) using its woody installation and the
sid chroot: 3.9 compiles/tests fine (both with Mark's handcrafted
Makefile and the one shipped by upstream, 4.3 does not. - Both on
woody (gcc 2.95) and sid (gcc 3.2.something).
The tests for pcre consist of running a test program, and then comparing 
its output against an expected output. One thing that the program does 
is the following:

new_info(re, extra, PCRE_INFO_STUDYSIZE, &size);
[...]
fprintf(outfile, "Study size = %d\n", size);
and this is what is different here. Now, although the size is returned 
from a function that's gets information about a particular regex, it's 
actually a constant, which is the size of the pcre_study_data structure.

This structure:
typedef struct pcre_study_data {
  size_t size;   /* Total that was malloced */
  uschar options;
  uschar start_bits[32];
} pcre_study_data;
is 48 bytes on alpha, 40 bytes on i386 and most other platforms. These 
are the figues that appear in the test failure report. I haven't tried 
ia64 or m68k, the other ones that failed, but I guess it's 48 on ia64; 
I'm not sure about 68k.

The main difference is that size_t is 8 bytes on alpha, being a 64-bit 
platform. I guess the other four bytes are padding.

Clearly, this test failure is nothing to worry about, but unfortunately 
the debian packages will not successfully build without all tests 
passing. I can release a fixed package that either ignores the result of 
this test, or has an altered pcretest.c that cheats.

Philip, I have CC'd you on this mail as the upstream author, because I 
believe this counts as a bug in pcre. I would suggest as a minimum 
removing the printing of the study size from the test.

Re: Proposal: removing libc5, altgcc and all their old-days dependencies

[Matthew Palmer]

On Thu, 19 Jun 2003, Philip Charles wrote:

> xpm4.7 is needed for WordPerfect 8.  I have a mass of wp5.1 and wp8
> documents.

Note that the packages won't be removed from your system, they will simply
no longer be in the Debian archive.  This *may* become a problem if you
clean-install a future version of Debian, but you should be able to get the
old xpm4.7 and it's dependencies from a Woody CD for some years to come.

And pester wordperfect^WCorel to use libraries from the current millenium.


-- 
---
#include 
Matthew Palmer, Geek In Residence
http://ieee.uow.edu.au/~mjp16

Hey How are you doing

[Lindsey McElroy]

	
 
	
	
 
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Original Message

debian-devel@lists.debian.org wrote:
> women will love you!

  

  

			
	
  

Re: Proposal: removing libc5, altgcc and all their old-days dependencies

[Philip Charles]

On Thu, 19 Jun 2003, Matthew Palmer wrote:

> On Thu, 19 Jun 2003, Philip Charles wrote:
>
> > xpm4.7 is needed for WordPerfect 8.  I have a mass of wp5.1 and wp8
> > documents.
>
> Note that the packages won't be removed from your system, they will simply
> no longer be in the Debian archive.  This *may* become a problem if you
> clean-install a future version of Debian, but you should be able to get the
> old xpm4.7 and it's dependencies from a Woody CD for some years to come.

Should be no problem.  This testing system started life as slink.

> And pester wordperfect^WCorel to use libraries from the current millenium.

Or pester openoffice.org for a WP filter and booklet printing.

Phil.

>
> --
> ---
> #include 
> Matthew Palmer, Geek In Residence
> http://ieee.uow.edu.au/~mjp16
>
>
>
> --
> To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>
>

--
  Philip Charles; 39a Paterson Street, Abbotsford, Dunedin, New Zealand
   +64 3 488 2818Fax +64 3 488 2875Mobile 025 267 9420
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] - preferred.  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 I sell GNU/Linux & GNU/Hurd CDs.   See http://www.copyleft.co.nz

Re: Bug#196800: flex mustn't assume stdint.h is available on allplatforms

[Neil Roeth]

On Jun 18, Manoj Srivastava ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
 > On Mon, 16 Jun 2003 22:55:53 -0400, Neil Roeth <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said: 
 > > On Jun 13, Daniel Jacobowitz ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
 > >> Certainly you have not broken Debian; but I maintain that this
 > >> short-sightedness does damage Debian's usefulness as a development
 > >> platform, for all those targets which many more practical
 > >> developers must support in order to do their jobs.
 > 
 > > I think this is an excellent point.  I can think of many times when
 > > I've done development work in Debian and ported the result to
 > > Solaris, IRIX or HPUX.  It is, of course, not a requirement for
 > > Debian that this be easy, but the easier it is, the more convincing
 > > the argument for integrating Debian into a mixed *nix environment,
 > > for everyone from developers to CIOs.
 > 
 >  Fine. You can then still choose to use flex-old (of course,
 >  any C++ scanners you have shall fail to work with gcc 3.3, and even
 >  for C scanners all bets are off wrt new compilers). 
 > 
 >  Or you can use the new flex, and get scanners that require
 >  conforming implementations.
 > 
 >  Debian offers you the cjoice -- since there is none which is
 >  unequivocally better.

I was addressing the more general "short-sightedness" point, not the specific
flex issue.  I suppose I could have stated that explicitly.  "[package] works
with all 11 architectures that comprise debian" is short sighted if there is
significant value to cross platform development, where cross platform means
Debian to non-Debian, not Debian arch to other Debian arch.

-- 
Neil Roeth

Re: Proposal: removing libc5, altgcc and all their old-days dependencies

[Matthew Palmer]

On Thu, 19 Jun 2003, Philip Charles wrote:

> > And pester wordperfect^WCorel to use libraries from the current millenium.
> 
> Or pester openoffice.org for a WP filter and booklet printing.

I was going to mention OOo, but since I don't know what it can currently do,
I wasn't about to put my foot in it one way or the other.  But yes, WP
converters would work very well.  As for booklet printing, print it as PS
from OOo and run it through the appropriate pstops script.  That'll get
booklets for you.


-- 
---
#include 
Matthew Palmer, Geek In Residence
http://ieee.uow.edu.au/~mjp16

Re: Proposal: removing libc5, altgcc and all their old-days dependencies

[Joshua Kwan]

On Thu, Jun 19, 2003 at 10:56:32AM +1200, Philip Charles wrote:
> xpm4.7 is needed for WordPerfect 8.  I have a mass of wp5.1 and wp8
> documents.

In my experience, either AbiWord or KWord is able to read these
documents. But of course, libwpd can't be perfect... you give some and
take some :)

-Josh

--
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Re: rsync in apt sources.list?

[Dan Jacobson]

It seems the simplest solution is to just use
http://home.tiscali.cz:8080/~cz210552/aptrsync.html
But why does he do at the bottom

# Get anything we missed due to failed rsync's.  [EMAIL PROTECTED] 24 Mar 2002.
os.system('apt-get update')
# Used to have a call to apt-cache gencaches here, but I think that's
# redundant with the apt-get update above. [EMAIL PROTECTED] 24 Mar 2002.

Doing apt-get update just seems to start downloading the Packages.gz
even though we just rsynced Packages.  Is apt supposed to detect
Packages are rater fresh and not download? It just downloaded over
again for me.

And of course commenting out apt-get update means that if some of the
servers in sources.list don't run rsync, then they won't be hit.