Re: RBL report..

[Craig Sanders]

On Wed, Mar 29, 2000 at 03:19:34PM -0800, Lawrence Walton wrote:
> Craig I meant you need those things to have a smtp HOST. You know; to 
> send and recive email, I was not commenting about DUL in any form. So 
> to say I was spreadding FUD is foolish, maybe you could of asked for  
> more information, or asked me to defined the context better.  

i read the message in context, i.e. in a thread about blocking spam and
DUL and ORBS and other RBLs.

> Stow your flamethrower for somthing worthy of setting on fire. :>

like failing to trim excess quoted text, and not wrapping lines at <=78
columns? :)

craig

--
craig sanders

Re: first draft "aptitude howto"

[Bernd Eckenfels]

On Wed, Mar 29, 2000 at 10:03:42PM +, Miquel van Smoorenburg wrote:
> I see you need to know a lot of keys. I think that is non-intuitive;
> a full screen interface should have pulldown menus (perhaps with
> shortcuts), a command line interface has switches.

Well, actually pull down menus are very seldom used with curses applications
and not very good. A short menu like tin or mutt/elm offers is IMHO enough,
and I think it is already there...

You can of course use some Function Keys in Addition to letter Keys, and
habe the Space-Key work on the current selection (cycle packet state), but
IMHO aptitude is a great advance over the dselect. Especially because of the
new package feature and the preview feature. The last functio i am missing
is a "install this" function, which avods to upgrade others (i use "apt-get
install" for that).

Greetings
Bernd

Re: RBL report..

[Craig Sanders]

On Wed, Mar 29, 2000 at 04:41:15PM -0700, Jason Gunthorpe wrote:
> On Thu, 30 Mar 2000, Craig Sanders wrote:
> > debian developers should have the option of a uucp account from one
> > of the debian servers (trivially easy for us to set up).
>
> I think we have been over this in various forms, I don't think we can
> do it without some complications,

the hardest complication would be coming up with a policy for reasonable
use...i.e. defining the rules under which the privilege is available.

> it would be inapproriate use of sponsored machines/bandwidth..

why is that? we already have debian developers whose primary email
address is @debian.org, and (IIRC) other developers who routinely use
smtp over ssh to debian servers to send their mail.

> It would be better for someone else to provide a service like this.

perhaps so. i think it would probably be a good idea for debian to
provide the service, but i'm not going to insist on it.

i don't see any problem with debian providing the service for debian
developers - at least to enable them to post to debian lists no matter
where they are dialed in to, if not as a general purpose service.

log files are easily summarised, so it would be possible to send a
"cease and desist" message to anyone who abused the privilege (i.e. by
sending hundreds of megabytes of mail per day or mail-bombed someone
through the uucp service)

craig

--
craig sanders

Re: RBL report..

[Craig Sanders]

On Thu, Mar 30, 2000 at 01:36:37AM +0200, Nils Jeppe wrote:
> On Thu, 30 Mar 2000, Craig Sanders wrote:
> 
> > yep. the DUL lists dynamic (dialup) IPs, it doesn't list static IPs.
> > that's why it's called the MAPS Dialup User List.
> 
> Well then I have to agree, DUL is bad, because it's near impossible
> to kill dial-in spammers, except to have their accounts revoked of
> course.

DUL is very effective in doing that. it prevents spammers from hiding
their activities from their ISP...which ensures that they will be caught
and their account nuked very promptly.

the ISP has a vested interest in taking an active role in preventing
spam - if they don't then they will be blacklisted by one of the RBLs
(e.g. MAPS RBL) for being a spamhaus.

that's the medium-term indirect effect of DUL...the immediately
beneficial direct effect is that spam from dialup users is blocked by
anyone who makes use of the DUL.

> Blocking the IPs is really stupid and ineffective and whoever thought
> of that bright idea should be given a very big Clue.

no, it's very effective and the people who thought of it have an
enormous clue.

what it does is prevent spammers from sending their junk directly...this
forces them to use their ISP's mail server, thus increasing the
effectiveness of the MAPS RBL because it forces the ISP to take
responsibility for their users' actions - it takes away their option to
bullshit and say "nothing to do with me, i only provide dialup service".

most users don't even have the option of sending their mail directly
because they are windows or mac dialup users and their mail client
insists on using a relay host. so DUL doesn't affect them at all.

the tiny percentage of unix users who have a real MTA can, and should,
use a legitimate mail relay (or uucp-over-tcp or smtp-over-ssh or one
of the many other alternatives). these are also the people who are
technically skilled enough to do so - and if they are not skilled enough
then they should not be running a mail server on the open internet
anyway...novice mail admins are the bane of real mail admins everywhere,
their fuckups cause problems all over the net (not the least of which
is that novice mail admins often run open relays through ignorance or
indifference to the spam problem)


> This however also means it's different enough from ORBS that I completely
> fail to see how people can throw them in together.

you are right, DUL & ORBS are quite different services. only joseph is
enough of a moron to equate the two.

craig

--
craig sanders

[Q] Recompiling packages for i686

[Sudhakar Chandrasekharan]

Hi,

I've heard that software compiled with optimizations for a particular
processor (say, i686) boosts performance by as much as 20%.  I was
wondering what is the best approach to take if I want to automatically
download src, compile and install all the packages that are currently
installed on my machine (sort of like 'make world' in  FreeBSD).

I know I can use apt-get to download source and the .diff file.  Anyone try
something like this before?

Thanks.

Thaths
PS: Am posting this to -devel because it concerns developers more than
users.
-- 
Lisa:  "Dad. You killed the zombie Flanders."
Homer: "He was a Zombie?"
Sudhakar C13n http://people.netscape.com/thaths/ Lead Indentured Slave

Re: RBL report..

[Nils Jeppe]

On Thu, 30 Mar 2000, Craig Sanders wrote:

> DUL is very effective in doing that. it prevents spammers from hiding
> their activities from their ISP...which ensures that they will be caught
> and their account nuked very promptly.

Okay, I see this point, however, I do have a problem with the categoric
blacklisting of IPs just because they're dialup.

> that's the medium-term indirect effect of DUL...the immediately
> beneficial direct effect is that spam from dialup users is blocked by
> anyone who makes use of the DUL.

Well, hmmm, only direct spam, but you are right. DUL and ORBS do make
for a quite potent combination.

I just realized this would also take care of that VERY annoying kind of
spam where spammers send spam directly to the 2nd highest MX record in a
zone. That mailserver looks at the MX and thinks, hey, not for me, but I'm
a fallback, let me just forward this, and my MTA thinks hey this is from
my fallback, I trust that guy.

DUL sounds better by the minute. I apologize for the Clue comment :-)


> forces them to use their ISP's mail server, thus increasing the
> effectiveness of the MAPS RBL because it forces the ISP to take
> responsibility for their users' actions - it takes away their option to
> bullshit and say "nothing to do with me, i only provide dialup service".

Any provider who says this should be tarred and feathered anyway
;)


> anyway...novice mail admins are the bane of real mail admins everywhere,
> their fuckups cause problems all over the net (not the least of which
> is that novice mail admins often run open relays through ignorance or
> indifference to the spam problem)

Tell me about it. Had enough troubles with these at work. At least they
all take a heavy hint very well. People get very nervous when they might
get their Mail access snipped.




-- 
 "Kif, if there's one thing I don't need it's your 'I don't think that's
  wise' attitude."
--- Zap Brannigan

Re: RBL report..

[Craig Sanders]

On Thu, Mar 30, 2000 at 02:17:55AM +0200, Nils Jeppe wrote:
> On Thu, 30 Mar 2000, Craig Sanders wrote:
> 
> > DUL is very effective in doing that. it prevents spammers from
> > hiding their activities from their ISP...which ensures that they
> > will be caught and their account nuked very promptly.
>
> Okay, I see this point, however, I do have a problem with the
> categoric blacklisting of IPs just because they're dialup.

i can see why you have a problem with that and i would agree with you
if there weren't any alternatives. however, as has been mentioned many
times, there are several alternatives, including (but not limited to)
the following:

a) use the ISP's mail relay
b) use uucp-over-tcp (requires uucp account somewhere)
c) use smtp-over-ssh (requires shell account somewhere)
d) pop-before-smtp or SMPT-Auth or SSL certificate relaying (requires
   mail account somewhere)


using the DUL is like a "no junk mail" sticker on your letter box...if
someone wants something delivered to your letter box they have to go
through the normal channels to do so (i.e. pay the postage). i don't
know about other countries, but here in Australia it is illegal to
ignore a "no junk mail" or "addressed mail only" sign on a letterbox.


> > that's the medium-term indirect effect of DUL...the immediately
> > beneficial direct effect is that spam from dialup users is blocked by
> > anyone who makes use of the DUL.
> 
> Well, hmmm, only direct spam, but you are right. DUL and ORBS do make
> for a quite potent combination.

personally, i don't use ORBS - too much collateral damage.  i use MAPS
RBL, MAPS RSS, and MAPS DUL...they make a very effective combination.

> I just realized this would also take care of that VERY annoying kind
> of spam where spammers send spam directly to the 2nd highest MX record
> in a zone. That mailserver looks at the MX and thinks, hey, not for
> me, but I'm a fallback, let me just forward this, and my MTA thinks
> hey this is from my fallback, I trust that guy.

yep, as long as the secondary MX uses the DUL that will work (and the
other RBLs too).

craig

--
craig sanders

Re: RBL report..

[Steve Greenland]

On 29-Mar-00, 15:21 (CST), Lawrence Walton <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: 
> 
> Nils: you still need a DNS named, static, route-able IP to be your own host.

I have DNS named, *dynamic*, routable IP -- thanks to the good folks at
dyndns.org. The only bad thing is that the reverse DNS isn't consistent.
I'm still not entirely comfortable getting e-mail sent directly to me,
which is why I POP most of it.

> Branden: You might consider getting a static.

That would be nice. Unfortunately, the choices at swbell (DSL) are
either one dynamic IP ($40/month), or 5 (!) static IPs, at $80/month +
$100 installation + $100 to set up the DNS (no, not register a domain,
*just* to configure the DNS). (And yes, they want the $100 installation
even though I already have everything set up and all they would have to
do is allocate the IP addresses.)

Steve

-- 
Steve Greenland <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
(Please do not CC me on mail sent to this list; I subscribe to and read
every list I post to.)

Re: Signing Packages.gz

[Anthony Towns]

On Wed, Mar 29, 2000 at 01:12:39PM +0200, Robert Bihlmeyer wrote:
> > Well, it'd be nice to be able to do so, to verify that a mirror hasn't
> > been compromised, but no, you're right.
> Actually I don't care that much if the mirror is compromised, if it
> affects only packages that I don't install. 

It would be nice for a compromised mirror to be able to easily work out
which packages were compromised.

> > Actually, now I think about it, the Packages file itself is valuable
> > information. Consider a Packages file that doesn't actually changes the
> > .deb's, but changes the netbase entry, say to read:
> > Package: netbase
> > Depends: vim
> > Conflicts: nvi, emacsen
> > and leaves everything else the same.
> 
> Nice one. Though, not possible the way I envision the "signed
> Packages.gz". Imagine the following:

Which, again, is not a method that I, at least, have ever seen proposed
before.

> Package: cvs
> Version: 1.10.7-7
> Priority: optional
> [...]
> installed-size: 944
> Signature-DSS: @[EMAIL PROTECTED])N871I=F4@:6YF;RUF:6QE('9I97=E<@H`

It has quite a few problems. The first is that it's not in a format
that tools can (currently) process easily. That's likely to kill it
straight away. (By `easily' I mean, writing a tidy ten line shell script
that'll verify a given Packages entry). 

Another is that these signatures are not currently made by
maintainers. That means you need to get every maintainer, and every porter
to manually recheck and re-sign and possibly reupload all their packages.

Another is that this doesn't cope with the fact that Packages files are
generated both from the .deb's themselves and from the overrides file
(which has the correct sections and priorities of .debs, as opposed
to what's listed in the .debs themselves) --- the Packages file isn't
the combined responsibility just of a bunch of maintainers it's the
responsibility of dinstall on master too.

Another problem is that maintaining these signatures would require changing
the way dinstall operates significantly.

Basically, it doesn't strike me as very practical.

> The `Signature-DSS' field contains a signature over all the fields,
> excluding itself. Since this includes the MD5sum, the package content
> can't be corrupted. But this also protects the package metadata.

Another difficulty (one that's not overly difficult to resolve, but could
be awkward implementation-wise) is that you'll need to specify an order
to your fields for this.

> > Speaking about `more secure than the debian machines themselves' is
> > meaningless. If you can compromise the debian machines themselves,
> > you're home and hosed. You can do anything and everything.
> Not true! If you have a trusted key of a developer, 

If you have the trusted key of a trusted developer even, you can't verify
that some guy in Azerbaijan is actually a developer or not. The Debian
web of trust isn't connected.

And what about all those people that haven't ever met a developer
in person? Should they just buy RedHat instead?

> no amount of
> fiddling with the debian machines could corrupt the source packages
> this developer uploaded without you noticing. 

Congratulations. You can be completely confident xtictactoe hasn't been
compromised.

And again, what happens if a maintainer who's kicked out doesn't want to
admit the fact? He's still in the web of trust, and if he can compromise
a mirror (which may well have been the /reason/ he was kicked out), he
can make sure the updated debian-keyring never makes its way to you, and
insert his own hax0red but signed packages into pub/debian/dists. With
a completely signed Packages.gz the best he can do is make you miss out
on getting upgrades.

Note that this isn't *much* of a vulnerability: his PGP key's already been
linked with his real-life identity by Debian, and his hacked packages have
been signed with his PGP key, so there could easily be repurcussions, but
it's still an /avoidable/ risk.

> > No, it doesn't. And what would such a mirror actually *do*? Just mirror
> > master as it gets compromised, and end up compromised itself?
> The premise was that master is not easily compromised (and if it is,
> we're hosed anyway at the moment). 

If master is not easily compromised then there isn't a concern with having
dinstall have a PGP key.

> But remember that users can't
> download from master, they have to use a by definition less secure
> mirror. A direct mirror under the auspices of the Debian admin-team
> would be a possibility for users to get it "straight from the horse's
> mouth".

Do you mean like ftp.debian.org?

The machine that can barely cope with the huge number of downloads
and connections? The machine that has trouble finding sponsors because
it uses more bandwidth than some not-particularly-small ISPs?

Now, we seem to have established that master can be considered
reasonably secure. What, exactly, is the /problem/ with having a single
widely-publicised `dinstall' key that automatically sig

Re: RBL report..

[Mark Brown]

On Wed, Mar 29, 2000 at 04:41:15PM -0700, Jason Gunthorpe wrote:

[Providing reliable SMTP services to people on dialup IP, eg
UUCP-over-TCP]

> It would be better for someone else to provide a service like this.

I have to say I'm extremely surprised that if ISPs in the US are as
incompetant as people seem to find them nobody's providing anything like
this.  Apparently, it's the standard model in some countries - you buy
connectivity from one place, mail from another.

I'd also be interested to know how the ISPs are managing to throw away
so much outbound mail, although I'm not sure I want to.

-- 
Mark Brown  mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]   (Trying to avoid grumpiness)
http://www.tardis.ed.ac.uk/~broonie/
EUFShttp://www.eusa.ed.ac.uk/societies/filmsoc/


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Advice on inetd Denial of Service Bug

[Anthony Towns]

Hello world,

inetd currently has a bug (Bug#60770) whereby internal services (in
particular discard/tcp) that fork don't close their inherited listening
sockets. This means that if:

* [EMAIL PROTECTED] telnets to debian.victim.com port 9
  (discard/sink/null)

* subsequently [EMAIL PROTECTED] either upgrades netbase,
  or manually stops and restarts inetd

...then inetd will quietly fail to start, and none of the inetd services
will continue to be available. Note that this is dependent on the *old*
version of inetd, not the new one being upgraded too.

I have a fix for the bug in my local source tree, but that still leaves a
window open for people upgrading from slink to potato, whereby they can
be DOSed until the admin notices and kills the offending -discard/inetd
process (or the systems reboots, whatever).

Unfortunately I can't think of a reasonable way of checking for this
in the preinst. The shell code I posted to the bug report works okay
for testing, but it'll report existing connections that are perfectly
reasonable, rather than just programs listening where they shouldn't be,
so it's not particularly good for sticking in a preinst and randomly
killing processes. It also depends on an optional package, which ain't
good.

Ideas? Or should I just forget it, and let people doing an upgrade look
out for themselves?

Cheers,
aj

-- 
Anthony Towns <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
I don't speak for anyone save myself. GPG encrypted mail preferred.

 ``The thing is: trying to be too generic is EVIL. It's stupid, it 
results in slower code, and it results in more bugs.''
-- Linus Torvalds


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Re: Advice on inetd Denial of Service Bug

[Ben Collins]

> Unfortunately I can't think of a reasonable way of checking for this
> in the preinst. The shell code I posted to the bug report works okay
> for testing, but it'll report existing connections that are perfectly
> reasonable, rather than just programs listening where they shouldn't be,
> so it's not particularly good for sticking in a preinst and randomly
> killing processes. It also depends on an optional package, which ain't
> good.
> 
> Ideas? Or should I just forget it, and let people doing an upgrade look
> out for themselves?

How about instead of killing processes, just want the user if such a
situation exists using the same check?

-- 
 ---===-=-==-=---==-=--
/  Ben Collins  --  ...on that fantastic voyage...  --  Debian GNU/Linux   \
` [EMAIL PROTECTED]  --  [EMAIL PROTECTED]  --  [EMAIL PROTECTED] '
 `---=--===-=-=-=-===-==---=--=---'

Re: RBL report..

[Branden Robinson]

On Thu, Mar 30, 2000 at 07:58:22AM +1000, Craig Sanders wrote:
[snip]

Why did you CC me?  I read the list.  Please control yourself.

-- 
G. Branden Robinson| The basic test of freedom is perhaps
Debian GNU/Linux   | less in what we are free to do than in
[EMAIL PROTECTED] | what we are free not to do.
roger.ecn.purdue.edu/~branden/ | -- Eric Hoffer


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Re: RBL report..

[Branden Robinson]

On Thu, Mar 30, 2000 at 01:25:03AM +0200, Nils Jeppe wrote:
> > Branden: You might consider getting a static.
> 
> The only way to live, imho. ;-)

You guys can stop CC'ing me any day now; I read the lists.

And BTW, I've stated several times that I *do* have a static IP.  I suppose
you guys are too busy disregarding my messages and spamming my inbox to
have noticed that.

-- 
G. Branden Robinson|Experience should teach us to be most on
Debian GNU/Linux   |our guard to protect liberty when the
[EMAIL PROTECTED] |government's purposes are beneficent.
roger.ecn.purdue.edu/~branden/ |-- Louis Brandeis


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Re: RBL report..

[Branden Robinson]

On Thu, Mar 30, 2000 at 10:34:05AM +1000, Craig Sanders wrote:
> On Thu, Mar 30, 2000 at 02:17:55AM +0200, Nils Jeppe wrote:

NILS JEPPE, CRAIG SANDERS:

PLEASE STOP CC'ING ME ON LIST MAILS.

-- 
G. Branden Robinson| The greatest productive force is human
Debian GNU/Linux   | selfishness.
[EMAIL PROTECTED] | -- Robert Heinlein
roger.ecn.purdue.edu/~branden/ |


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Re: Advice on inetd Denial of Service Bug

[Herbert Xu]

Anthony Towns  wrote:
>
> Unfortunately I can't think of a reasonable way of checking for this
> in the preinst. The shell code I posted to the bug report works okay
> for testing, but it'll report existing connections that are perfectly
> reasonable, rather than just programs listening where they shouldn't be,
> so it's not particularly good for sticking in a preinst and randomly
> killing processes. It also depends on an optional package, which ain't
> good.

Surely you can check whether the process is inetd by looking up
/proc/pid/exe?

As to the dependency on fuser, hmm, now what's that thing called netstat(1)
which happens to be in your package and also happens to have a flag called
-p? :)
-- 
Debian GNU/Linux 2.1 is out! ( http://www.debian.org/ )
Email:  Herbert Xu ~{PmV>HI~} <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Home Page: http://gondor.apana.org.au/~herbert/
PGP Key: http://gondor.apana.org.au/~herbert/pubkey.txt

Re: no freeramdisk? -> util-linux

[Edward Betts]

Eric Delaunay <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>   I'm attempting to write support for scsidev at boot time in conjonction with
> a fork of hwtools to create a new scsitools package that will provide only the
> scsi stuff of hwtools and compile on non-i386 Debian architectures.
> However, my scripts will eventually make use of freeramdisk which is not
> available on all architectures.  In fact, it is currently only provided by
> loadlin on i386 :((  (see wishlist bug #49878).
> 
> I don't think it's worth creating a stand alone package for freeramdisk (which
> is 3k) so the best package I found to move to is util-linux.
> 
> Do you agree with this proposal?  It should go under /bin or /sbin (/sbin
> preferably) because I need it early at boot time, before any partition (like
> /usr) is mounted.
> 
> I will file a bug against loadlin & util-linux if I get a consensus on it.

Seconded.

-- 
while :;do read x;echo \?;done


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[package] drakxtools; diskdrake partition manager

[bug1]

Hi, ive made my first debian package, Mandrakes drakxtools, it contains
a number of configuration tools, but my primary reason for packaging is
to provide diskdrake.

Diskdrake is a graphical partition manager, it allows resizing
parititions etc. I originally thought this would be good during
installation, but as it requires X and gtk i dont think it would be
suitable.

drakxtools also contains configuration tools XFdrake, keyboarddrake,
mousedrake, lspcidrake, printerdrake, netdrake.

drakxtools are nearly totally perl scripts, my perl skills arent that
good, i couldnt work out how to efficiently seperate diskdrake from the
rest, so the package contains all the tools.

One problem is that these configuration tools all bahave as they should
on a Mandrake system, they havent been modified to suit debian yet
as i said i primarily wanted to package diskdrake.

The various drakxtools are also called by lothar, which is a mandrake
sponsored hardware detection program. lothar has been packaged by Dan
Helfman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> it is waiting for a sponsor

Im not an official debian maintainer yet (but want to be) if anyone
feels upto it i could do with some advice/feedback on my efforts so far.

I still have a fair bit of work to do before this package is ready, but
diskdrake does work.

The package as it is so far is at
ftp://computernerds.com.au/debian/drakxtools/ this is a permanent modem
connection, so expect it to be slow.

Thanks

Glenn McGrath

Re: Advice on inetd Denial of Service Bug

[Anthony Towns]

On Thu, Mar 30, 2000 at 02:35:43PM +1000, Herbert Xu wrote:
> As to the dependency on fuser, hmm, now what's that thing called netstat(1)
> which happens to be in your package and also happens to have a flag called
> -p? :)

*blush*

On the upside, netstat also distinguishes between listening and accepting
sockets, unlike fuser (afaict). On the downside, it doesn't have a nice
`query' command line. Oh well:

sed -n 's/[[:space:]]/ /g;s/  */ /g;/^ *[^#]/p' /etc/inetd.conf | 
cut -d" " -f1,3,4 | 
while read a b c; do 
if [ "$c" = "wait" ]; then 
continue; 
fi; 
X=`grep "[0-9]*/$b" /etc/services | 
sed 's/^/^/;s/$/$/' | 
grep "[^a-z0-9]$a[^a-z0-9]" | 
sed 's/[[:space:]]/ /g;s/  */ /g' | 
cut -d\  -f2 | 
sed 's,/.*$,,'`; 
if [ "$X" ]; then 
echo $X $b; 
else 
echo $a $b; 
fi; 
done | 
while read a b; do 
sudo netstat -n -lp -t -u | 
sed 's/LISTEN//;s/[[:space:]]/ /g;s/  */ /g' | 
cut -d\  -f1,4,6  | 
sed -n 's,^\([^ ]*\) \([^ :]*\):\([0-9]*\) 
\([0-9]*\)/\(.*\)$,\3 \1 \4,p'  | 
sed -n "s/^$a $b //p"; 
done 2>/dev/null | 
sort | 
uniq | 
xargs ps u

...seems to work.

Yeesh.

Cheers,
aj

-- 
Anthony Towns <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
I don't speak for anyone save myself. GPG encrypted mail preferred.

 ``The thing is: trying to be too generic is EVIL. It's stupid, it 
results in slower code, and it results in more bugs.''
-- Linus Torvalds


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Re: RBL report..

[Marc Haber]

On Wed, 29 Mar 2000 17:15:56 -0600, you wrote:
>Couldn't the original Received: headers be renamed to X-Received: (or
>something like that; although I could figure out how to make that
>happen with formail I don't know my mail headers well enough to know
>if X-Received is already used by something else).

One site I use uses Old-Received: to keep Received:-Headers generated
before a forward operation. OTOH, I feel that an MTA choking on too
many Received: headers is broken is the maximum number of Received:
headers processed correctly is well below 30.

Greetings
Marc

-- 
-- !! No courtesy copies, please !! -
Marc Haber  |   " Questions are the | Mailadresse im Header
Karlsruhe, Germany  | Beginning of Wisdom " | Fon: *49 721 966 32 15
Nordisch by Nature  | Lt. Worf, TNG "Rightful Heir" | Fax: *49 721 966 31 29

"GNU/Linux" vs. "Linux"

[Martin Schulze]

Ok folks, why is Debian called "GNU/Linux" instead of simply "Linux"?
Is that documented somewhere?  On a web-page, faq, other document?

Regards,

Joey

-- 
The good thing about standards is that there are so many to choose from.
-- Andrew S. Tanenbaum

Please always Cc to me when replying to me on the lists.

Re: "GNU/Linux" vs. "Linux"

[Jakob 'sparky' Kaivo]

Martin Schulze <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

> Ok folks, why is Debian called "GNU/Linux" instead of simply "Linux"?
> Is that documented somewhere?  On a web-page, faq, other document?

IIRC, Debian was originally funded by the FSF, who wouldn't have it
any other way. Leavinger personal opinions aside in the hopes of not
starting a flame war, it makes sense especially given that there is
now a Debin GNU/Hurd distribution.

-- 
Jakob 'sparky' Kaivo - [EMAIL PROTECTED] - http://jakob.kaivo.net/

Re: "GNU/Linux" vs. "Linux"

[Martin Schulze]

Jakob 'sparky' Kaivo wrote:
> Martin Schulze <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> 
> > Ok folks, why is Debian called "GNU/Linux" instead of simply "Linux"?
> > Is that documented somewhere?  On a web-page, faq, other document?
> 
> IIRC, Debian was originally funded by the FSF, who wouldn't have it
> any other way. Leavinger personal opinions aside in the hopes of not
> starting a flame war, it makes sense especially given that there is
> now a Debin GNU/Hurd distribution.

That was not the point and not the source of my question.  But 
thanks anyway.  Brendan O'Dea got me the URL:


http://www.gnu.org/gnu/linux-and-gnu.html
http://www.debian.org/doc/FAQ/ch-basic_defs.html#s-gnu


Regards,

Joey

-- 
The good thing about standards is that there are so many to choose from.
-- Andrew S. Tanenbaum

Re: "GNU/Linux" vs. "Linux"

[Hamish Moffatt]

On Wed, Mar 29, 2000 at 11:59:07PM -0800, Jakob 'sparky' Kaivo wrote:
> Martin Schulze <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> 
> > Ok folks, why is Debian called "GNU/Linux" instead of simply "Linux"?
> > Is that documented somewhere?  On a web-page, faq, other document?
> 
> IIRC, Debian was originally funded by the FSF, who wouldn't have it
> any other way. Leavinger personal opinions aside in the hopes of not
> starting a flame war, it makes sense especially given that there is
> now a Debin GNU/Hurd distribution.

There was also a time where RMS felt GNU was not getting 
the recognition it deserved, because Debian etc were basically
"The GNU System" on the Linux kernel, but the name didn't reflect that.
So then there was the 'lignux' debate.


Hamish
-- 
Hamish Moffatt VK3SB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

Re: "GNU/Linux" vs. "Linux"

[Peter Makholm]

Martin Schulze <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

> http://www.debian.org/doc/FAQ/ch-basic_defs.html#s-gnu

I've read that before. I'm to new of a developer to know anything. But
isn't the story that Debian started with strong connections to FSF,
dropped them and then after a long flamefest reestablished them with
the Debian GNU/Linux name?

(It's the "we are happy to comply with that request." part I'm not
sure about.)

Is there a website with the debian-history package online?

And does that tell anything in support of my knowledge? 


Facts not flames, please (Not that you care).

-- 
They say that the Hand of Elbereth can hold up your prayers. 

How to hide/show cursor without Ncurses ?

[lorenzo . zampese]

How can I hide/show the cursor on a generic text terminal (xterms
included),
without using the famous 'ncurses' libraries ?
And about colors and text scrolling ?

I found an interesting document on internet (unix programmer FAQ v1.31)
concerning
how to program terminals, tasks, mailing, etc., but it doesn't explain the
above questions.

It is very strange that there are so many documents about the linux's
configuration,
but a so very little number about the programming, or not ?


Thank you.

Re: How to hide/show cursor without Ncurses ?

[Craig Sanders]

On Thu, Mar 30, 2000 at 11:18:31AM +0100, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> How can I hide/show the cursor on a generic text terminal (xterms
> included), without using the famous 'ncurses' libraries ?

use ncurses, then you don't have to make any hard-coded assumptions
about the terminal's capabilities.  that's why it exists.

programming a unix text mode program which assumes that it's running
on a linux console or vt100 or xterm is evil...even more evil than dos
weenie programmers assuming that their text mode program is going to run
on a "standard" 80x25 IBM PC console, with or without ansi.sys

"dos weenie" programmers at least have the excuse that they are writing
for MS-DOS and that they are weenies. unix programmers shouldn't make
the same mistakes.

there's no such thing as a "standard" or "generic" text terminal, and
a unix programmer should always keep that in mind. even different
implementations of the same de-facto standards (like vt100) are not the
same, what works on one "vt100-clone" terminal is not guaranteed to work
on another "vt100-clone"...that's why the ncurses terminfo database has
hundreds of entries for various slightly different vt100 clones.


> And about colors and text scrolling ?

ditto.


> I found an interesting document on internet (unix programmer FAQ
> v1.31) concerning how to program terminals, tasks, mailing, etc., but
> it doesn't explain the above questions.
>
> It is very strange that there are so many documents about the linux's
> configuration, but a so very little number about the programming, or
> not ?

there's lots of programmers' documentation - most libraries are
documented (with quality ranging from poor to truly excellent). most
programming tools (e.g. make and gcc) have excellent documentation.
the problem isn't so much being able to find docs, as knowing where to
start.


craig (not a real programmer, but i pretend to be one from time to time)

--
craig sanders

dwww: cat and file (pipe race condition)

[Ulf Jaenicke-Roessler]

Hi,

 I'm reading my system documentation with dwww. However, with current
 potato/woody versions of dwww and file I have trouble for some files
 (i.e the web server hangs and reports a timeout)

 Examples for "bad" files are
 http://localhost/cgi-bin/dwww?type=file&location=/usr/doc/menu/html/ch3.html
 or
 http://localhost/cgi-bin/dwww?type=file&location=/usr/doc/menu/html/ch6.html

 while
 http://localhost/cgi-bin/dwww?type=file&location=/usr/doc/menu/html/ch2.html

 works fine.

 It seems, that the problem only occurs with longer (more than 1 chars)
 files. Looking for the cause of this problem, I found that the line
 "$decompress $file | file -b - | magic2mime" in dwww-convert is responsible.

 Apparently the $decompress command (which is actually 'cat') is not
 finished when file has its job already done. I can find a 'dangling'
 cat process with 'ps'. So the pipe is not closed and the system would
 wait forever (actually just until the timeout is reached or cat is
 killed).

 I downloaded the source of the file package, but I don't know what
 I need to change. How are such pipe problems normally handled?


 Thanks,
  
  Ulf

Re: Permissions/ownerships of /cdrom and /floppy

[Santiago Vila]

On Wed, 29 Mar 2000, Bruce Perens wrote:

> Permissions on mount points don't seem to make much difference. I was able to
> mount a filesystem on a mount point with mode 0, and once mounted the
> permissions come from the mounted filesystem, not the mount point.

While we are at it, is there a rationale for /boot to be root.disk,
group-writeable and set-gid?

Thanks.

-- 
 "9df07a2f088de86a208acac8afa4d756" (a truly random sig)

latest basefiles package...

[Stefan Ott]

hello

i just upgraded my woody system using with apt-get 
("http://http.us.debian.org/debian unstable main contrib non-free")
and now my consoles say "Debian GNU/Linux 2.2 (frozen)" instead of
"Debian GNU/Linux woody" ... i guess this is a packaging
whoops-this-was-the-wrong-string problem...

regards
stefan

Re: What's changed in su/bash? "bash: fork: Resource temporarily unavailable"

[Oliver Elphick]

Josh Wilmes wrote:
  >
  >Are you possibly out of memory?  (perhaps a process has run away and gobbled
  > 
  >it up)?

No; the problem is only if I try to get an interactive su session:

   [EMAIL PROTECTED] cat /proc/meminfo
   total:used:free:  shared: buffers:  cached:
   Mem:  131403776 123076608  8327168 54677504  4624384 49696768
   Swap: 269676544 44146688 225529856
   MemTotal:128324 kB
   MemFree:   8132 kB
   MemShared:53396 kB
   Buffers:   4516 kB
   Cached:   48532 kB
   SwapTotal:   263356 kB
   SwapFree:220244 kB
   [EMAIL PROTECTED] su -c ls
   Password: 
   0.0=1.29172.exmh  exmh.1563.html   filevV2bSYpg7
   ...
   [EMAIL PROTECTED] su
   Password: 
   linda:/tmp# ls
   bash: fork: Resource temporarily unavailable
   linda:/tmp#  cd 
   linda:~# 

but, as you see, shell built-ins still work.

 
-- 
Oliver Elphick[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Isle of Wight  http://www.lfix.co.uk/oliver
   PGP key from public servers; key ID 32B8FAA1
 
 "But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace,  
  patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness,   
  gentleness, self control; against such there is no   
  law."Galatians 5:22,23  

Re: What's changed in su/bash? "bash: fork: Resource temporarily unavailable"

[Josh Wilmes]

Interesting.   Try "ulimit -a".  Any strange limits set?

--Josh


> Josh Wilmes wrote:
>   >
>   >Are you possibly out of memory?  (perhaps a process has run away and gobbl
ed
>   > 
>   >it up)?
> 
> No; the problem is only if I try to get an interactive su session:
> 
>[EMAIL PROTECTED] cat /proc/meminfo
>total:used:free:  shared: buffers:  cached:
>Mem:  131403776 123076608  8327168 54677504  4624384 49696768
>Swap: 269676544 44146688 225529856
>MemTotal:128324 kB
>MemFree:   8132 kB
>MemShared:53396 kB
>Buffers:   4516 kB
>Cached:   48532 kB
>SwapTotal:   263356 kB
>SwapFree:220244 kB
>[EMAIL PROTECTED] su -c ls
>Password: 
>0.0=1.29172.exmh  exmh.1563.html   filevV2bSYpg7
>...
>[EMAIL PROTECTED] su
>Password: 
>linda:/tmp# ls
>bash: fork: Resource temporarily unavailable
>linda:/tmp#  cd 
>linda:~# 
> 
> but, as you see, shell built-ins still work.
> 
>  
> -- 
> Oliver Elphick[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Isle of Wight  http://www.lfix.co.uk/oliver
>PGP key from public servers; key ID 32B8FAA1
>  
>  "But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace,  
>   patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness,   
>   gentleness, self control; against such there is no   
>   law."Galatians 5:22,23  
> 
> 

Re: How to hide/show cursor without Ncurses ?

[lorenzo . zampese]

Thank you

-
The ones you called "weenie dos programmer" were not so "weenie", because
the old Ms-dos worked on PCs with a Ibm 80x25 terminal in the 90-95% of
cases.
Then that assumption was a standard "de facto"...

Anyway, you didn't answer to my question !

Re: Ian Jackson, please get me the hell off your blacklist.

[Stephen Early]

On Wed, 29 Mar 2000, Branden Robinson wrote:

> Mar 29 15:20:15 apocalypse sendmail[7886]: e2T8qEi03048: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> .greenend.org.uk, ctladdr=branden (1000/1000), delay=11:28:01, xdelay
> =00:00:21, mailer=esmtp, pri=6332789, relay=chiark.greenend.org.uk.
>  [195.224.76.132], dsn=4.2.0, stat=Deferred: 450 Site not yet trusted, 
> try later [Irritated]
> 
> Maybe you'd care to explain to me what's not trusted about my site?

See .

Note that the response from chiark said "450 Site not yet trusted, try
later". First of all, note that it's a temporary failure (450) and
your MTA should retry automatically. Also the text says "not yet" and
"try later", both of which suggest that the message will be accepted
at some point in the future.

> Irritated?  *YOU'RE* irritated?
> 
> If you don't correct this at once I will be forced to re-evaluate my
> place within a project that is nominally devoted to free and open
> communication among its members and the rest of the world.

All of the recent discussion about various blacklists, dial-up user
lists, etc. seems to have frayed people's tempers. I see a lot of
messages from angry people, with little useful content. I suggest
everyone takes a step back and thinks before sending further mail: do
you really want to waste time arguing about this, and flying off the
handle for no good reason?

Steve Early

Re: What's changed in su/bash? "bash: fork: Resource temporarily unavailable"

[Oliver Elphick]

Josh Wilmes wrote:
  >
  >Interesting.   Try "ulimit -a".  Any strange limits set?

Not that I can see:

  [EMAIL PROTECTED] su
  Password: 
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] ulimit -a
  core file size (blocks) unlimited
  data seg size (kbytes)  unlimited
  file size (blocks)  unlimited
  max locked memory (kbytes)  unlimited
  max memory size (kbytes)unlimited
  open files  1024
  pipe size (512 bytes)   8
  stack size (kbytes) 8192
  cpu time (seconds)  unlimited
  max user processes  256
  virtual memory (kbytes) unlimited


The su being used is /bin/su from login
(source package: shadow; Version: 19990827-18)

-- 
Oliver Elphick[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Isle of Wight  http://www.lfix.co.uk/oliver
   PGP key from public servers; key ID 32B8FAA1
 
 "But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace,  
  patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness,   
  gentleness, self control; against such there is no   
  law."Galatians 5:22,23  

Re: Ian Jackson, please get me the hell off your blacklist.

[Ian Jackson]

Branden Robinson writes ("Ian Jackson, please get me the hell off your 
blacklist."):
> Mar 29 15:20:15 apocalypse sendmail[7886]: e2T8qEi03048: [EMAIL PROTECTED], 
> ctladdr=branden (1000/1000), delay=11:28:01, xdelay=00:00:21, mailer=esmtp, 
> pri=6332789, relay=chiark.greenend.org.uk. [195.224.76.132], dsn=4.2.0, 
> stat=Deferred: 450 Site not yet trusted, try later [Irritated]
> 
> Maybe you'd care to explain to me what's not trusted about my site?

My site has only just met yours.  Specifically, my system will defer
mail for the first three hours from any new IP address.  Hence `not
_yet_ trusted, try later'.  A properly-configured MTA will try again
for some time, and the message will get through.  (Some sites have
several sending MTAs, but these will soon all have been seen at least
three hours ago, so the mail will get through.)

Do you have your retry duration configured well below the
recommendations in Host Requirements ?

> Since I cannot communicate with bug report filers from
> chiark.greenend.org.uk, all bug reports submitted, past, present, or
> future, by people from that host will be summarily closed.

Perhaps we should debug the mail problem first.

Ian.

Re: Advice on inetd Denial of Service Bug

[Paul Slootman]

On Thu 30 Mar 2000, Herbert Xu wrote:
> 
> As to the dependency on fuser, hmm, now what's that thing called netstat(1)
> which happens to be in your package and also happens to have a flag called
> -p? :)

   $ man netstat
   [...]
   SYNOPSIS
  netstat   [-venaoc]   [--tcp|-t]   [--udp|-u]   [--raw|-w]
  [--groups|-g] [--unix|-x] [--inet|--ip]  [--ax25]  [--ipx]
  [--netrom]

  netstat   [-veenc]  [--inet]  [--ipx]  [--netrom]  [--ddp]
  [--ax25] {--route|-r}

  netstat [-veenpac] {--interfaces|-i} [iface]

  netstat [-enc] {--masquerade|-M}

  netstat [-cn] {--netlink|-N}

  netstat {-V|--version} {-h|--help}

   DESCRIPTION
   [...]

Hmm, I don't see -p

   [...]
  -p, --programs
  displays process name and PID of the owner of each  socket
  it dumps. You have to be the owner of such process to have
  all it's sockets matched to it or generally root user will
  see all the necessary information in place.

Ah, it's not in the synopsis, but _is_ described.

BTW: it should be "all its sockets", no apostrophe.


Paul Slootman
-- 
home:   [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.wurtel.demon.nl/
work:   [EMAIL PROTECTED]   http://www.murphy.nl/
debian: [EMAIL PROTECTED]  http://www.debian.org/
isdn4linux: [EMAIL PROTECTED]   http://www.isdn4linux.de/

Re: RBL report..

[Robert Bihlmeyer]

Craig Sanders <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

> most of the recent spam would have been blocked by using MAPS RSS
> (relays.mail-abuse.org), though...and not by MAPS DUL.
> 
> IMO, we should use both. individually they are quite effective in
> blocking spam, but they are even better when used together.

Before all useful points are lost in the flamage, may I suggest that a
X-Filtered-By: DUL
or similar header be added to all list mail?

-- 
Robbe

Re: RBL report..

[Eric Weigel]

This spam issue is so political.

If you're stuck with a service provider who has a crappy mail
service, and/or who has your IP listed on the DUL, I'll offer a
solution.

I run an ISP in Canada. We offer shell accounts, on a machine
running Debian Potato, for a reasonable price ($10/month, or $60/year) 
Then you can use SSH to tunnel mail through my server.  The box is
running sendmail 8.9.3

I'm pretty anal about people who try to use the shell server for DoS or
theft of service (ie spam)  I don't expect anyone on this list would do
either.

A description of our shell service can be found at
http://shell.bestnet.org/

Any current Debian developer will get the service for half price on a
yearly basis ($30/year)  Same goes for people with sponsored packages.

Email [EMAIL PROTECTED] if you're interested.

As for the list spam issue:  spam on the lists is annoying, but not a
showstopper (yet)  I think the "X-Spam" header idea is a good one. 
Politics aside, it allows for a simple and public examination of which
of DUL, ORBS etc catch what spam on the list, without stopping any
legitimate mail from getting through.

I also believe that stripping Received headers is a mistake.  They are
useful for tracking problems, not just spam.  Maybe X-Received is an
option for dealing with broken mailers.

Cheers!
Eric

-- 

Mathematics belongs to God -- Donald Knuth

Re: RBL report..

[Hamish Moffatt]

On Thu, Mar 30, 2000 at 01:12:10PM +0200, Robert Bihlmeyer wrote:
> Before all useful points are lost in the flamage, may I suggest that a
> X-Filtered-By: DUL
> or similar header be added to all list mail?

Apparently qmail can't do that out of the box.
Yes, we are still being hypocritical and running qmail on murphy
(lists.debian.org).


Hamish
-- 
Hamish Moffatt VK3SB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

Re: RBL report..

[Bob Nielsen]

On Thu, Mar 30, 2000 at 10:34:05AM +1000, Craig Sanders wrote:

> b) use uucp-over-tcp (requires uucp account somewhere)
> c) use smtp-over-ssh (requires shell account somewhere)

Can someone point me to any references on setting up either of these. 
I had to give up my static IP and often have problems with my ISP's
smtp server.  I notice that the alternate access method I have for
reaching my ISP (via uunet) filters so you cannot reach port 25 on any
servers other than their own (and I do understand their reason for
doing so).  One of these methods would get around that (unless they
also filter on ports 465 and 540).

Bob
 

Re: "GNU/Linux" vs. "Linux"

[Michael Meskes]

On Thu, Mar 30, 2000 at 10:53:38AM +0200, Peter Makholm wrote:
> I've read that before. I'm to new of a developer to know anything. But
> isn't the story that Debian started with strong connections to FSF,

It did. Ian Murdock did work for the FSF early on.

> dropped them and then after a long flamefest reestablished them with
> the Debian GNU/Linux name?

Yup.

Michael
-- 
Michael Meskes | Go SF 49ers!
Th.-Heuss-Str. 61, D-41812 Erkelenz| Go Rhein Fire!
Tel.: (+49) 2431/72651 | Use Debian GNU/Linux!
Email: Michael@Fam-Meskes.De   | Use PostgreSQL!

(Bug horizon) Problem bugs

[Richard Braakman]

The following packages have survived the bug horizon, in some cases twice,
because they are too important to drop.  These bugs will delay the release
of potato.

Package: boot-floppies (debian/main).
Maintainer: Debian Install System Team 
  58266 [fixed in CVS] PCMCIA network install is broken
  58779 boot-floppies: Can't boot on my Powerpc
  58857 The boot floppies do not work with milex raid on root.
  60218 [fixed in CVS] error when setting active partition
  60306 [fixed in CVS] Serial console does not work on initial boot
  60370 [fixed in CVS] libdb2 missing from base?
  60371 [fixed in CVS] base, installation glitches (configure network, start ne
w system)
  60956 [fixed in CVS] ARM is not supported (patch included)
  61229 boot-floppies: lilo.conf refers to /boot instead of /
  61280 i386 bootdisks fail with 8 MB of memory
[ New boot-floppies are almost ready ]

Package: debianutils (debian/main).
Maintainer: Guy Maor <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
  59121 run-parts hangs during /etc/cron.daily runs

Package: dpkg (debian/main).
Maintainer: Wichert Akkerman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
  33237 /etc/alternatives/emacs not managed properly - /usr/bin/emacs doesn't r
un emacs20
[STRATEGY] Switches to manual-mode too quickly, maintainer will look at
   it this weekend.
  58091 package name "Eterm" --> "eterm"
  60973 zope names itself Zope in the control

Package: g++ (debian/main).
Maintainer: Debian GCC maintainers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
[HELP] For gcc/g++ bug reports to be sent to the upstream maintainers,
certain procedures must be followed, so help from clueful people is required
  48530 g++ [fixed in 2.96 CVS Feb 2000] [alpha]: internal compiler error build
ing open-amulet
[WAITING] Maintainer was contacted on Dec 12, awaiting reply.
  55291 [alpha] g++ causes internal compiler error compiling hatman

Package: gcc (debian/main).
Maintainer: Debian GCC maintainers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
  58412 r-base: Can't build from source
  59819 gcc_2.95.2-7(frozen): fails to compile itself on m68k
  61258 missing header files in include/asm on non-i386 architectures

Package: libc6-dev (debian/main).
Maintainer: Joel Klecker 
  59962 sys/ucontext.h shouldn't define ERR

Package: nscd (debian/main).
Maintainer: Joel Klecker 
  58367 nscd: 'broken pipe' error causes entire box to be unusable

Package: pdl (debian/main).
Maintainer: Raul Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
  55268 [Strategy: use older version on alpha] PDL fails to compile on alpha

Re: RBL report..

[David N. Welton]

Is there any kind of database to filter out time-wasting, vitriolic
arguments full of personal attacks, about things that have nothing to
do with Debian?

I guess there is, but come on people, enough is enough.  Just hit the
delete key and get over it.  There are tons of things to do to make
Debian better, go do those instead of wasting your time with this
drivel.

(rant 'off)
-- 
David N. Welton, Responsabile Progetti Open Source, Linuxcare Italia spa
tel +39.049.8043411 fax +39.049.8043412 cel +39.348.2879508
[EMAIL PROTECTED], http://www.linuxcare.com/
Linuxcare. Support for the revolution.

Re: latest basefiles package...

[Santiago Vila]

On Thu, 30 Mar 2000, Stefan Ott wrote:

> i just upgraded my woody system using with apt-get 
> ("http://http.us.debian.org/debian unstable main contrib non-free")
> and now my consoles say "Debian GNU/Linux 2.2 (frozen)" instead of
> "Debian GNU/Linux woody" ... i guess this is a packaging
> whoops-this-was-the-wrong-string problem...

So you are running woody and not potato, which is in frozen state and
should be tested by everybody? :-)

[ I've just uploaded base-files_2.1.19.0 today, will fix your problem ].

Thanks.

-- 
 "e587ec75ddd4d5e04974778d971e6c60" (a truly random sig)

Re: RBL report..

[Alexander Koch]

On Wed, 29 March 2000 14:31:50 -0700, Jason Gunthorpe wrote:
> This is deliberately removed, we had some problems a year or so ago with
> the received lines getting too long for some mailers. We are looking at
> putting them back.

There are some sites out there that have a limit of 15 and
you are able to reach above 15. Heh, the daily listmaster
box is fun when someone subscribes with a yahoo.com address
that gets forwarded to iname (argh!) which is brought to
some ISP in .fr and then there comes a completely fscked
fetchmail config that is bouncing every single mail without
the "self-made admin" knowing it, complaining why he got
unsub'ed by me after 50 bounces.

scnr.

I say we go for it and it worth a try. Stay tuned.

Alexander,
believing in random sigs instead

-- 
Tech support is a fine art which, once mastered, virtually ensures
loss of sanity. Joe Thompson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Alexander Koch - <>< - WWJD - aka Efraim - PGP 0xE7694969 - ARGH-RIPE

Re: RBL report..

[Alexander Koch]

On Thu, 30 March 2000 05:53:20 -0500, Eric Weigel wrote:
> If you're stuck with a service provider who has a crappy mail
> service, and/or who has your IP listed on the DUL, I'll offer a
> solution.

Also uucp over tcp/ip is offered for quite a small monthly
charge at cid.net, have whatever hostname you want to have.

That service is in Germany, but see after uucp.cid.net for
a traceroute, it should be rather well- connected (although
nacamar sux big rocks from time to time).

Please contact [EMAIL PROTECTED] if you have any questions.

Alexander

-- 
Don't think about it. It just works. Grace alone knows why.
 -- me, in despair...
Alexander Koch - <>< - WWJD - aka Efraim - PGP 0xE7694969 - ARGH-RIPE

Re: Fwd: Re: unable to execute

[Russell Coker]

On Tue, 28 Mar 2000, Tristan Savatier wrote:
>> It works (well runs, I have no VCDs to test with at work) and display
>> help (mtvp -h). Even the graphical intreface works too. That .deb was
>> mtv_1.1.0.20-2_i386.deb
>>
>> When I install the glibc2.1 version (mtv_1.1.0.20-3_i386.deb) it
>> promptly fails. You don't seem to have any dependancy information in
>> your .deb's which is probably a bad thing.
>
>Our deb package files are derived from our RPM's using the
>'alien' script.  Looks like alien is not perfect.

Of course alien can't maintain dependencies.  The packages don't always have 
the same names in different distributions, and there is not always a 1:1 
mapping of packages.  A set of programs that is one package in Red Hat might 
be 3 packages in Debian.

>> Debian 2.1 ships with libc6-2.0.7.19981211-6; Corel has the same
>> version. Debian 2.2 has libc6-2.1.3-7 (currently). Perhaps depending
>> on the right version of the libc6 would be good.
>
>yes, but that would force us to make debian-specific packages.
>we don't want that.  we want RPM to be our master packages,
>and we convert to other formats (DEB, SLP) using alien.

Which of course makes things harder for everyone.  Really it's not that 
difficult to add a debian/ directory into the source tree.  I'm sure that 
there's plenty of volunteers to do it for you.
You can easily setup a basic Debian development environment in a chroot 
directory on your Red Hat system and then compile native Debian packages with 
all correct dependencies and save such problems in future.

>> >  usually when this type of thing happens, it is something
>> > broken with the libraries.  mtvp is one of the few multithreaded
>> > applications, and anything broken in the thread support would be fatal
>> > for mtvp.
>>
>> They've installed the wrong version; perhaps updating your ver web
>> site with information for Corel would be useful too.
>
>certainely a good idea.  we'll do that.  thanks for your help
>understanding the situation.  still, I don't fully understand
>why glibc2.1 and glibc2.0 are not binary (API) compatible ?
>It looks like a major problem to me, and causes havoc again
>(I mean, after the glibc2.0/libc5 incompatibility).

IMHO going from libc5 to libc6 was a non-issue.  You can have both versions 
installed on the same machine.  Each program will be linked exclusively with 
one or the other.  So it's no big deal.  Glibc2 to Glibc2.1 uses the same SO 
major numbers so you can't install both at once and it sometimes breaks 
things.  This is annoying.

-- 
My current location - X marks the spot.
X
X
X

Re: Packages removed from potato

[Adrian Bunk]

On Thu, 30 Mar 2000, Richard Braakman wrote:

>...
> Package: libgd-graph-perl (debian/contrib).
> Maintainer: Piotr Roszatycki <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>   59442 libgd-graph-perl: Missing files, missing dependencies
>...

This also takes out rmagic.


cu,
Adrian

-- 
A "No" uttered from deepest conviction is better and greater than a
"Yes" merely uttered to please, or what is worse, to avoid trouble.
-- Mahatma Ghandi

Re: Packages removed from potato

[Richard Braakman]

On Thu, Mar 30, 2000 at 03:17:17PM +0200, Adrian Bunk wrote:
> On Thu, 30 Mar 2000, Richard Braakman wrote:
> 
> >...
> > Package: libgd-graph-perl (debian/contrib).
> > Maintainer: Piotr Roszatycki <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >   59442 libgd-graph-perl: Missing files, missing dependencies
> >...
> 
> This also takes out rmagic.

You're right.  My apt installation was set up only for main, so I didn't
notice.  

I've now removed rmagic from frozen as well.

Richard Braakman

Re: ITP: manpages-da

[Fabrizio Polacco]

On Fri, Mar 24, 2000 at 11:58:39AM +0100, Peter Makholm wrote:
> In SSLUG (swedish/danish LUG) we have begun translating
> man-pages to danish. when we have finished a nice set (like
> file-utils) I will make a debian package out of it.

Great!
Please, as some of these people tend to use RedHat (yes, not anybody
knows that Debian is better :-), there is a marked tendency to find
manpages for man,whatis,apropos or even makewhatis which are translated
from that distro.

As Debian is shipping a different man program, please remove those pages
from your package.
Instead, ask the translators to translate also the Debian pages (man-db
ships 9 manpages) and the po file.
That would be wonderful. When done, ship them to me so I'll include them
in man-db.

Thanx,
fab
-- 
| [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
| pgp: 6F7267F5   57 16 C4 ED C9 86 40 7B 1A 69 A1 66 EC FB D2 5E
| [EMAIL PROTECTED] gsm: +358 (0)40 707 2468

Re: Permissions/ownerships of /cdrom and /floppy

[Peter Palfrader]

Hi Santiago!

On Thu, 30 Mar 2000, Santiago Vila wrote:

> On Wed, 29 Mar 2000, Bruce Perens wrote:
> 
> > Permissions on mount points don't seem to make much difference. I was able 
> > to
> > mount a filesystem on a mount point with mode 0, and once mounted the
> > permissions come from the mounted filesystem, not the mount point.
> 
> While we are at it, is there a rationale for /boot to be root.disk,
> group-writeable and set-gid?

hmmm

drwxr-xr-x2 root root 4096 Mar  8 02:01 /boot/

on my potato system.

HTH

yours,
peter

-- 
PGP encrypted messages prefered.
http://www.cosy.sbg.ac.at/~ppalfrad/


pgpC8D3uut9MD.pgp
Description: PGP signature

What happened to rrdtool in potato?

[Alexander Reelsen]

Hi

I'm wondering why the package 'rrdtool' does not exist anymore for potato?
Because it has been to old?
Because the older version couldn't built from source?
Is it orphaned? (Then I would take it, when becoming a developer). Though
it is not listed in prospective-packages.html.

Where can I get infos about (the listed problems above were accessible via
http://bugs.debian.org/rrdtool) the situation?


MfG/Regards, Alexander

--
Alexander Reelsen http://joker.rhwd.de
[EMAIL PROTECTED]   GnuPG: pub 1024D/F0D7313C  sub 2048g/6AA2EDDB
  7D44 F4E3 1993 FDDF 552E  7C88 EE9C CBD1 F0D7 313C

Bug#49962: Old and new man pages - clean solution possible.

[Fabrizio Polacco]

On Wed, Mar 29, 2000 at 10:50:07PM +0200, Andreas Krüger wrote:
> 
> Closing Bug 49962, Raphael Hertzog <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> 
> > Everything has been said, and there's no clean
> > solution. It would be a crude hack to make (all or most of
> > the) packages conflict with an old man-db simply because
> > the man page moved.
> 
> That'd be a crude hack indeed.  But aren't there any smarter
> ways to go about this?
> 
> Here is an attempt at a clean solution:
> 
> Provide a new package "port-man-db".  This package is very
> small, mainly consisting of one single shell - script
> /usr/sbin/port-man-db .
> 
> This script checks wether man-db is installed on the system
> at all.  If it isn't, the script does nothing.  If the
> script finds the old man-db, the neccessary tweaking is done
> to get it to accept new pages.  When the script runs a
> second time on an old man-db system, it finds its own
> tweaking in place and does nothing more.  If the script
> finds the new man-db, nothing is done, either.

check /usr/lib/man-db/chconfig on potato:

  # tool to convert the man-db configuration file to the FHS.
  # it slurps the file in argument (default /etc/manpath.config) and,
  # it tries to make the changes to comply with FHS.

it is called by postinst:

if  [ -x "$(which perl)" -a -x "$chconfig" ]
then$chconfig $conffile
...

You can put this script in an essential package like Guy's debianutils
(like in /usr/lib/debianutils/chconfig ) and run it in postinst.

It is idempotent, so having it also in man-db does no harm.

If you decide to go and NMU debianutils (is Guy still around?) then this
would be the right moment to put undocumented(7) in it, and stop another
series of boring bugs :-)

fab, wearing its hat of man-db maintainer.
PS.: if it was not yet clear, I repeat it here:
you don't need a new "man" program to read FHS pages, just to change the
configfile.
-- 
| [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED]
| pgp: 6F7267F5   57 16 C4 ED C9 86 40 7B 1A 69 A1 66 EC FB D2 5E
| [EMAIL PROTECTED] gsm: +358 (0)40 707 2468

Re: What's changed in su/bash? "bash: fork: Resource temporarily unavailable"

[Junichi Uekawa]

In Thu, 30 Mar 2000 11:10:20 +0100, de profundis "Oliver Elphick" 
 cum veritas scribat

Try from another user :

ps axu | grep root | wc 

and see how many processes root is running ...


--
dancer, a.k.a. Junichi Uekawa   http://www.netfort.gr.jp/~dancer
 Dept. of Knowledge Engineering and Computer Science, Doshisha University.
... Long Live Free Software, LIBERTAS OMNI VINCIT.

Re: dwww: cat and file (pipe race condition)

[Daniel Martin]

[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Ulf Jaenicke-Roessler) writes:

>  It seems, that the problem only occurs with longer (more than 1 chars)
>  files. Looking for the cause of this problem, I found that the line
>  "$decompress $file | file -b - | magic2mime" in dwww-convert is responsible.

Well, if I do a 
$process | file -b - | magic2mime

where "$process" is anything that produces a large amount of output
slowly, then the process is killed by a SIGPIPE in short order.

If, however, I do:
$process | (file -b -; cat >/dev/null) | magic2mime
then it seems that the process runs happily (that is, no signals) to
completion.

However, this may not be what you really would want.  (Since waiting
for process to finish could cause the webserver to time out)  What
your problem may be is that somehow the cat process is not receiving
the SIGPIPE signal; I would then try to see about rewriting the dwww
script so that it does.  (I'm not sure how to do this, since the bash
manpage seems to imply that one can't change which signals are ignored 
by the shell).

You could test whether cat is ignoring the SIGPIPE signal by sending
the dangling cat process such a signal and seeing if it dies.

Re: What happened to rrdtool in potato?

[Raphael Hertzog]

Le Thu, Mar 30, 2000 at 04:49:20PM +0200, Alexander Reelsen écrivait:
> I'm wondering why the package 'rrdtool' does not exist anymore for potato?
> Because it has been to old?

No because it had a release critical bug that nobody took care to correct
... even if the bug was trivial to fix. The first bug horizon catched this
package.

> Because the older version couldn't built from source?

Yes.

> Is it orphaned? (Then I would take it, when becoming a developer). Though
> it is not listed in prospective-packages.html.

It's not officially orphaned but it's no maintained anymore since the
maintainer could have fixed this bug long ago and he never replied to the
email I sent to the BTS.

Cheers,
-- 
Raphaël Hertzog >> 0C4CABF1 >> http://tux.u-strasbg.fr/~raphael/
 CD Debian : http://tux.u-strasbg.fr/~raphael/debian/#cd
  Formations Linux et logiciels libres : http://www.logidee.com 

Re: Advice on inetd Denial of Service Bug

[Drew Bloechl]

On Thu, Mar 30, 2000 at 01:11:09PM +0200, Paul Slootman wrote:
>   -p, --programs
>   displays process name and PID of the owner of each  socket
>   it dumps. You have to be the owner of such process to have
>   all it's sockets matched to it or generally root user will
>   see all the necessary information in place.

IIRC -p doesn't work on 2.0 kernels.  I believe 2.2 added the fields 
required for this in /proc/net/tcp.  

You can track this information down the hard way with the 
pseudo-inode netstat gives you by referencing them against 
/proc//fd/*, but that's not a very attractive solution.  

-- 
Drew Bloechl
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

quick dpkg-scanpackages

[Nick Cabatoff]

Is there any way currently of adding to a Packages file incrementally?
Even on a fairly quick machine it takes a while to scan 500 packages,
and when I've only changed 1 it'd be nice not to have to wait.

If not, I'll be happy to write some code, I just don't want
duplication of effort.

Strange behaviour

[Michael Meskes]

I usually run my shell with LC_ALL set to de_DE. Calling 'printf "%1.1f\n" 1'
then gives me 1,0 which is the correct answer under the german locale.

Now I unset LC_ALL to get the command to print 1.0 but wasn't able to.
However, running under strace it works. Finally I tried a subshell but that
doesn't cut it either:

[EMAIL PROTECTED]:~$ printf "%1.1f\n" 1
1,0
[EMAIL PROTECTED]:~$ unset LC_ALL
[EMAIL PROTECTED]:~$ printf "%1.1f\n" 1
1,0
[EMAIL PROTECTED]:~$ strace printf "%1.1f\n" 1 2>/dev/null
1.0
[EMAIL PROTECTED]:~$ (printf "%1.1f\n" 1)
1,0

Anyone out there who could explain this to me? In particular this means that
I get a warning from netscape everytime I start it.

Michael

-- 
Michael Meskes | Go SF 49ers!
Th.-Heuss-Str. 61, D-41812 Erkelenz| Go Rhein Fire!
Tel.: (+49) 2431/72651 | Use Debian GNU/Linux!
Email: Michael@Fam-Meskes.De   | Use PostgreSQL!

Re: What happened to rrdtool in potato?

[Matt Zimmerman]

On Thu, Mar 30, 2000 at 07:23:09PM +0200, Raphael Hertzog wrote:

> > Is it orphaned? (Then I would take it, when becoming a developer). Though
> > it is not listed in prospective-packages.html.
> 
> It's not officially orphaned but it's no maintained anymore since the
> maintainer could have fixed this bug long ago and he never replied to the
> email I sent to the BTS.

It is neither officially orphaned nor 'no maintained anymore'.  I have prepared
a fixed version, and I am waiting for it to be uploaded by my sponsor.

Your email to the BTS did not warrant a reply; you told me how to fix the
problem, and I have prepared a fix.

-- 
 - mdz

Not to get off on a rant here.....

[Franklin Belew]

Hi, you may know me from such irc channels as #debian and #debian-devel
as Myth.


If you have a short temper, don't read this.
If you are more advocate about freedom at any cost than RMS, don't read this.
If you just ggot done reading the RBL/DUL/ORBS thread, please, don't
take your anger out on me.

This is just my opinions on what I've seen in the debian project in the last
2+ years that I've been using it.

People seem to be too caught up in other people's "freedom" to help us 
create the best distro with the least problems. Example:
/usr/doc -> /usr/share/doc transition voted to be held because potato was
supposed to freeze back in november. 
Freeze got delayed, and 4+ months later, no one has taken this transition 
seriously. I am to assume that all debian developers are mature individuals
who understand the concept of deadlines, yet giving this much slack only 
causes the releases to be later and later.

New-maintainer has been closed waaay too long. I first applied back in May 
of last year, only to find that they were not acepting new apps. Then in 
september I find that my app was lost anyway. I have been told "get a 
sponsor" and "do other things"; but after 6+ months of getting a sponsor 
and doing other things, it is still frustrating that I (and many others 
like me) can't officially be part of the debian crew. Yes, I know it is a 
lot of work to process the applications, but those of us who weren't/aren't
maintainers had no information about why it was close, when it would open, 
or if [EMAIL PROTECTED] was just sent to /dev/null. Now that a 
new process has been initiated, this problem will never hopefully occur
again. 


These may sound like the disgruntled ramblings of a frustrated wannabe 
developer, but I hope you can see where I am coming from.


Now, before you flame me, or tell me things I have read 100 times on this
list in the last year and a half I've been reading it, please for all of 
our sakes, take a deep breath, step back, think about the situation, and 
inform us all of where I am mistaken in a mature manner.

Thank you, 
This ends your normal broadcast day.


pgpctYnxamVQ0.pgp
Description: PGP signature

Re: (Bug horizon) Problem bugs

[Steve Greenland]

On 30-Mar-00, 05:43 (CST), Richard Braakman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: 
> The following packages have survived the bug horizon, in some cases twice,
> because they are too important to drop.  These bugs will delay the release
> of potato.
> 
> Package: debianutils (debian/main).
> Maintainer: Guy Maor <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>   59121 run-parts hangs during /etc/cron.daily runs

There's a reasonable looking explanation and patch associated with this
bug. Guy, would you like me to do an NMU?

Steve

-- 
Steve Greenland <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
(Please do not CC me on mail sent to this list; I subscribe to and read
every list I post to.)

Re: Not to get off on a rant here.....

[Chip Salzenberg]

According to Franklin Belew:
> Hi, you may know me from such irc channels as #debian and #debian-devel
> as Myth.

I'm Troy McClure!  Er, no, that's not right.

> These may sound like the disgruntled ramblings of a frustrated wannabe 
> developer, but I hope you can see where I am coming from.

Oh, you're entirely right.  People _are_ too tied up in 'freedom' to
focus on the software.  But that's because, as a body, the Debian
project is all about freedom, as _expressed_ in software (and other
things, too).

You want pragmatism?  Work with FreeBSD.  No flame, no smiley.
-- 
Chip Salzenberg  - a.k.a. -  <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
"I wanted to play hopscotch with the impenetrable mystery of existence,
but he stepped in a wormhole and had to go in early."  // MST3K

Re: (Bug horizon) Problem bugs

[Chip Salzenberg]

According to Richard Braakman:
> Package: gcc (debian/main).
> Maintainer: Debian GCC maintainers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>   58412 r-base: Can't build from source
>   59819 gcc_2.95.2-7(frozen): fails to compile itself on m68k
>   61258 missing header files in include/asm on non-i386 architectures

May I assume that the latter two bugs will not delay the release of
potato for i386?

> Package: pdl (debian/main).
> Maintainer: Raul Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>   55268 [Strategy: use older version on alpha] PDL fails to compile on alpha

Likewise?
-- 
Chip Salzenberg  - a.k.a. -  <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
"I wanted to play hopscotch with the impenetrable mystery of existence,
but he stepped in a wormhole and had to go in early."  // MST3K

Re: What's changed in su/bash? "bash: fork: Resource temporarily unavailable"

[Brian Greenfield]

On Fri, 31 Mar 2000 00:12:12 +0900, Junichi Uekawa
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

>In Thu, 30 Mar 2000 11:10:20 +0100, de profundis "Oliver Elphick" 
> cum veritas scribat

>and see how many processes root is running ...

237!

Samba running as a daemon rather than from inetd seems to
have cured it.

Re: What happened to rrdtool in potato?

[Raphael Hertzog]

Le Thu, Mar 30, 2000 at 01:40:31PM -0500, Matt Zimmerman écrivait:
> It is neither officially orphaned nor 'no maintained anymore'.  I have
> prepared a fixed version, and I am waiting for it to be uploaded by my
> sponsor.
> 
> Your email to the BTS did not warrant a reply; you told me how to fix the
> problem, and I have prepared a fix.

Great, sorry for the confusion, however you could have fixed this RC bug
way before the first bug horizon, you haven't done such a good job by
taking so long ... I don't want to blame you but RC bugs (and particularly
when they are trivial to fix) should be fixed ASAP. If you can't fix
those bugs yourself, then you need to ask for help wherever needed
(debian-qa, debian-devel, ...).

Cheers,
-- 
Raphaël Hertzog >> 0C4CABF1 >> http://tux.u-strasbg.fr/~raphael/
 CD Debian : http://tux.u-strasbg.fr/~raphael/debian/#cd
  Formations Linux et logiciels libres : http://www.logidee.com 

Re: (Bug horizon) Problem bugs

[Ben Collins]

On Thu, Mar 30, 2000 at 11:12:27AM -0800, Chip Salzenberg wrote:
> According to Richard Braakman:
> > Package: gcc (debian/main).
> > Maintainer: Debian GCC maintainers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >   58412 r-base: Can't build from source
> >   59819 gcc_2.95.2-7(frozen): fails to compile itself on m68k
> >   61258 missing header files in include/asm on non-i386 architectures
> 
> May I assume that the latter two bugs will not delay the release of
> potato for i386?
> 
> > Package: pdl (debian/main).
> > Maintainer: Raul Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >   55268 [Strategy: use older version on alpha] PDL fails to compile on alpha
> 
> Likewise?

Couldn't be more wrong. Bugs are bugs...a package with a serious bug on a
supported arch, affects that package period, no matter what arch you are
talking about.

-- 
 ---===-=-==-=---==-=--
/  Ben Collins  --  ...on that fantastic voyage...  --  Debian GNU/Linux   \
` [EMAIL PROTECTED]  --  [EMAIL PROTECTED]  --  [EMAIL PROTECTED] '
 `---=--===-=-=-=-===-==---=--=---'

Re: How to hide/show cursor without Ncurses ?

[Matthias Hertel]

[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
> Anyway, you didn't answer to my question !

What Craig said about curses was absolutely right, but if you really
want to hardwire the codes, look at
console_codes(4)linux console
/usr/share/doc/xterm/ctlseqs.ms.gz  xterm

If you want to use some control codes in shell scripts, don't hardcode
them, look at tput(1) and terminfo(5) instead, e.g.
echo "This is $(tput smso)standout$(tput rmso), and this is not"

HTH
Matthias

Re: debconf: how to configure non-interactive install

[Joey Hess]

Thomas Gebhardt wrote:
> yes, that's what I want to do. My aim is to use FAI (Fully automated
> installation, cf. http://www.informatik.uni-koeln.de/fai/) for
> the installation of potato. Currently FAI tries to install the
> packages non-interactively with the default values (using
> various heuristics such as '(yes "" | dpkg --configure -a') and
> configures the system with cfengine. It would be nice to supply
> a native debconf method for configuration.

If you are willing to accept the defaults specified in debconf packages,
you can just set DEBIAN_FRONTENT=Noninteractive in the environment before
running dpkg, and debconf will use the defaults for everything.

If you need to change defaults for some reason, it grows more complicated,
and you'll have to pre-seed the answer database before installing stuff.

-- 
see shy jo

Re: What happened to rrdtool in potato?

[Matt Zimmerman]

On Thu, Mar 30, 2000 at 09:22:41PM +0200, Raphael Hertzog wrote:

> Great, sorry for the confusion, however you could have fixed this RC bug
> way before the first bug horizon, you haven't done such a good job by
> taking so long ... I don't want to blame you but RC bugs (and particularly
> when they are trivial to fix) should be fixed ASAP. If you can't fix
> those bugs yourself, then you need to ask for help wherever needed
> (debian-qa, debian-devel, ...).

Like most volunteers, my efforts are made on a time-available basis.  For the
past few weeks, my time has been very limited.  I missed the announcement on
debian-devel-announce that rrdtool was to be removed, and I was not notified
personally.  For such a simple fix, this would have been a prime target for an
NMU, especially to keep the package in potato.  I certainly would not have
objected.

-- 
 - mdz

Re: Packages removed from potato

[Remco Blaakmeer]

On Thu, 30 Mar 2000, Richard Braakman wrote:

> Package: smail (debian/main).
> Maintainer: Soenke Lange <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> [HELP] Mail to Soenke bounced.
>   59135 smail: Smail doesn't work with the latest libraries

Has anybody been able to reproduce this bug? I have been running smail
from xinetd for ages and I have never seen the behavior described in the
bug report.

I am running current potato, which includes:

ii  smail   3.2.0.102-2 Electronic mail transport system.
ii  libc6   2.1.3-7 GNU C Library: Shared libraries and 
Timezone data
ii  libident0.22-2  simple RFC1413 client library - 
runtime
ii  libwrap07.6-4   Wietse Venema's TCP wrappers library
ii  cron3.0pl1-56   management of regular background 
processing
ii  util-linux  2.10f-3 Miscellaneous system utilities.

If nobody can reproduce the bug, I'd say it can be downgraded to 'fixed'.

To the submitter: can you reproduce the bug with current potato packages?

Remco
-- 
rd1936:   9:15pm  up 10 days,  2:35,  8 users,  load average: 1.32, 1.31, 1.23

Re: Bug#59135: Packages removed from potato

[Bart Warmerdam]

On Thu, Mar 30, 2000 at 10:01:16PM +0200, Remco Blaakmeer wrote:
> On Thu, 30 Mar 2000, Richard Braakman wrote:
> 
> > Package: smail (debian/main).
> > Maintainer: Soenke Lange <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > [HELP] Mail to Soenke bounced.
> >   59135 smail: Smail doesn't work with the latest libraries
> 
> Has anybody been able to reproduce this bug? I have been running smail
> from xinetd for ages and I have never seen the behavior described in the
> bug report.
> 
  Remco,

  Since smail didn't run at all I switched from smail to exim. I don't have
  the setting to try again now, but it failed with an really up-to-date system
  at the time... Also the maintainer didn't fix some unalignment bugs. This
  causes the program to dump at least 4 lines of warnings every time a mail
  gets processed. Maybe this is a program you don't want to run anymore on a
  busy production server anyway under these conditions... (fix is in BTS
  and mailed some 5+ times as well).

  B.

--
B. Warmerdam  GNU/Debian Linux
[EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Keyid: 10A0FDD1)   

Re: RBL report..

[Robert Bihlmeyer]

Hamish Moffatt <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

> On Thu, Mar 30, 2000 at 01:12:10PM +0200, Robert Bihlmeyer wrote:
> > Before all useful points are lost in the flamage, may I suggest that a
> > X-Filtered-By: DUL
> > or similar header be added to all list mail?
> 
> Apparently qmail can't do that out of the box.

What about the list processor?

-- 
Robbe

Re: (Bug horizon) Problem bugs

[Chip Salzenberg]

According to Ben Collins:
> On Thu, Mar 30, 2000 at 11:12:27AM -0800, Chip Salzenberg wrote:
> > May I assume that the latter two bugs will not delay the release of
> > potato for i386?
> 
> Couldn't be more wrong. Bugs are bugs...a package with a serious bug on a
> supported arch, affects that package period, no matter what arch you are
> talking about.

But that makes no sense ... I'm a Debian developer, but I have no
access to any m68k machines.  Yet potato, which includes some of my
work, can't be released ... and I can do nothing about it?

Feh.
-- 
Chip Salzenberg  - a.k.a. -  <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
"I wanted to play hopscotch with the impenetrable mystery of existence,
but he stepped in a wormhole and had to go in early."  // MST3K

Re: (Bug horizon) Problem bugs

[Will Lowe]

> But that makes no sense ... I'm a Debian developer, but I have no
> access to any m68k machines.  Yet potato, which includes some of my
> work, can't be released ... and I can do nothing about it?

According to http://db.debian.org/machines.cgi, you can get an account on
kullervo.debian.org.

Will

--
|   [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED]  |
|   http://www.cis.udel.edu/~lowe/   |
|PGP Public Key:  http://www.cis.udel.edu/~lowe/index.html#pgpkey|
--

Re: (Bug horizon) Problem bugs

[Ben Collins]

On Thu, Mar 30, 2000 at 01:02:46PM -0800, Chip Salzenberg wrote:
> According to Ben Collins:
> > On Thu, Mar 30, 2000 at 11:12:27AM -0800, Chip Salzenberg wrote:
> > > May I assume that the latter two bugs will not delay the release of
> > > potato for i386?
> > 
> > Couldn't be more wrong. Bugs are bugs...a package with a serious bug on a
> > supported arch, affects that package period, no matter what arch you are
> > talking about.
> 
> But that makes no sense ... I'm a Debian developer, but I have no
> access to any m68k machines.  Yet potato, which includes some of my
> work, can't be released ... and I can do nothing about it?
> 
> Feh.

I don't believe you are the only one working on the problem. Also, if you
looked, you would find that there are several m68k systems you can request
access to, so as to troubleshoot the problem.

You could also forward the bug upstream, or make a request to the
respective debian-m68k list for help.

-- 
 ---===-=-==-=---==-=--
/  Ben Collins  --  ...on that fantastic voyage...  --  Debian GNU/Linux   \
` [EMAIL PROTECTED]  --  [EMAIL PROTECTED]  --  [EMAIL PROTECTED] '
 `---=--===-=-=-=-===-==---=--=---'

Re: What's changed in su/bash? "bash: fork: Resource temporarily unavailable"

[Oliver Elphick]

Brian Greenfield wrote:
  >On Fri, 31 Mar 2000 00:12:12 +0900, Junichi Uekawa
  ><[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
  >
  >>In Thu, 30 Mar 2000 11:10:20 +0100, de profundis "Oliver Elphick" <[EMAIL 
PROTECTED]
  >x.co.uk> cum veritas scribat
  >
  >>and see how many processes root is running ...
  >
  >237!
  >
  >Samba running as a daemon rather than from inetd seems to
  >have cured it.
 
So all of a sudden, any process started through 'su root' is limited by
ulimit, which is counting all processes belonging to root, including daemons.
But a direct login to root is not limited in this way.

Why this change? and which package changed it?

-- 
Oliver Elphick[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Isle of Wight  http://www.lfix.co.uk/oliver
   PGP key from public servers; key ID 32B8FAA1
 
 "But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace,  
  patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness,   
  gentleness, self control; against such there is no   
  law."Galatians 5:22,23  

Re: (Bug horizon) Problem bugs

[Chip Salzenberg]

According to Will Lowe:
> According to http://db.debian.org/machines.cgi, you can get an
> account on kullervo.debian.org.

I hadn't thought to look there.  Silly me.
-- 
Chip Salzenberg  - a.k.a. -  <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
"I wanted to play hopscotch with the impenetrable mystery of existence,
but he stepped in a wormhole and had to go in early."  // MST3K

Re: Strange behaviour

[Michael Sobolev]

On Thu, Mar 30, 2000 at 07:48:00PM +0200, Michael Meskes wrote:
> I usually run my shell with LC_ALL set to de_DE.
Usually using LC_ALL is not a very good idea.  It's better to use LANG, or, if
you want only particular aspects of the program behaviour to be localized,
LC_CTYPE, LC_MESSAGE, LC_TIME, LC_NUMERIC.

> [EMAIL PROTECTED]:~$ printf "%1.1f\n" 1
> 1,0
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]:~$ unset LC_ALL
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]:~$ printf "%1.1f\n" 1
> 1,0
I'd execute `locale' command at this point.

More information about the issue is available as locale(7) (i.e.
`man 7 locale')

--
Mike

Re: Strange behaviour

[Robert Bihlmeyer]

Michael Meskes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

> I usually run my shell with LC_ALL set to de_DE. Calling 'printf "%1.1f\n" 1'
> then gives me 1,0 which is the correct answer under the german locale.
> 
> Now I unset LC_ALL to get the command to print 1.0 but wasn't able
> to.

printf is a bash builtin. bash only evaluates the locale on startup.

-- 
Robbe

Re: How to hide/show cursor without Ncurses ?

[Craig Sanders]

On Thu, Mar 30, 2000 at 12:22:56PM +0100, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> The ones you called "weenie dos programmer" were not so "weenie",
> because the old Ms-dos worked on PCs with a Ibm 80x25 terminal in the
> 90-95% of cases.
>
> Then that assumption was a standard "de facto"...

and it was proven to be a broken assumption when 80x43 and other
screen sizes became common. as has been proven over and over again in
the history of computing, hard-coding assumptions about screen size,
terminal type, or other output characteristics is just plain wrong (and
is doomed to cause significant problems in the near future).

> Anyway, you didn't answer to my question !

yes i did.  my answer was that you were asking the wrong question.

craig

--
craig sanders

ATTN: pjw@edmc.net

[Joseph Carter]

If you wish to email me about any of my packages, do so from an address
which does not reject my mail as coming from a "dialup" IP.  My IP is
STATIC and your ISP is run by morons who can't tell the difference, even
though I am no longer listed on the DUL.  I am attempting once and once
only to reach you via the lists.  I will not attempt to do so in the
future.  Mail me from an ISP with a clue in the future if you'd like a
reply.

Regarding your problem, epic4 pre2.507 (uploaded today) should fix it.

-- 
Joseph Carter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>   GnuPG key 1024D/DCF9DAB3
Debian GNU/Linux (http://www.debian.org/) 20F6 2261 F185 7A3E 79FC
The QuakeForge Project (http://quakeforge.net/)   44F9 8FF7 D7A3 DCF9 DAB3

 Zoid: we're nuts, but we're productive nuts:)
 taniwha: Quote material :)
* taniwha wonders what productive nuts taste like
 Endy: :)
 Endy: I already snipped it

Re: Advice on inetd Denial of Service Bug

[Herbert Xu]

Drew Bloechl <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On Thu, Mar 30, 2000 at 01:11:09PM +0200, Paul Slootman wrote:
>>   -p, --programs
>>   displays process name and PID of the owner of each  socket
>>   it dumps. You have to be the owner of such process to have
>>   all it's sockets matched to it or generally root user will
>>   see all the necessary information in place.

> IIRC -p doesn't work on 2.0 kernels.  I believe 2.2 added the fields 
> required for this in /proc/net/tcp.  

The only piece of info that 2.2 has over 2.0 is the socket/pipe flag in
/proc/pid/fd.  This is not really needed.  The inode info were added back
in the 1.3.* days.

However, it is true that the current netstat wants this piece of information.
So the question is whether it is worthwile to fix netstat for 2.0.* when it
is going to be totally obsolete soon when 2.4 comes out.

Anyway, if the check is to be implemented at all, it'll have to be in postinst
since slink's netstat doesn't do -p.

> You can track this information down the hard way with the 
> pseudo-inode netstat gives you by referencing them against 
> /proc//fd/*, but that's not a very attractive solution.  

Which is essentially what netstat does with -p.
-- 
Debian GNU/Linux 2.1 is out! ( http://www.debian.org/ )
Email:  Herbert Xu ~{PmV>HI~} <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Home Page: http://gondor.apana.org.au/~herbert/
PGP Key: http://gondor.apana.org.au/~herbert/pubkey.txt

Re: WNPP

[Stephen Zander]

> "Michael" == Michael Vogt <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
Michael> If you like the package :-) Of course. The package lacks
Michael> a good example /etc/aide.conf. If someone has a nice
Michael> example, please send it to me. I will include it in the
Michael> package.

Let me know once this gets in and I'll happilty orpah tripwire. :)

-- 
Stephen

"If I claimed I was emporer just cause some moistened bint lobbed a
scimitar at me they'd put me away"