[Tutor] a puzzle about -3**2 vs (-3)**2

2015-07-31 Thread D Wyatt
I just read in a book a little while ago that ** trumps a negative sign? I am struggling with the audacity of that as -1 is negative 1, NOT minus 1. How can an arithmetic operation trump an attribute of a negative integer? It truly makes no sense to me. Thank you for any enlightenment you can p

Re: [Tutor] String Attribute

2015-07-31 Thread ltc.hotspot
Hi Alan, I rewrote the code as follows: fname = raw_input("Enter file name: ") if len(fname) < 1 : fname = "mbox-short.txt" fh = open(fname) count = 0 for line in fh: if not line.startswith('From'): continue line2 = line.strip() line3 = line2.split() line4 = lin

Re: [Tutor] 'open' is not defined

2015-07-31 Thread ltc.hotspot
Hi Emile, I hope this answers your question? Question: How do I remove each duplicate line output? Here is the raw data code: fname = raw_input("Enter file name: ") if len(fname) < 1 : fname = "mbox-short.txt" fh = open(fname) count = 0 for line in fh: if not line.startswith('

Re: [Tutor] String Attribute

2015-07-31 Thread Alan Gauld
On 31/07/15 01:25, ltc.hots...@gmail.com wrote: fname = raw_input("Enter file name: ") if len(fname) < 1 : fname = "mbox-short.txt" fh = open(fname) count = 0 for line in fh: if not line.startswith('From'): continue line2 = line.strip() line3 = line2.split() line4 = line3[1]

Re: [Tutor] a puzzle about -3**2 vs (-3)**2

2015-07-31 Thread Alan Gauld
On 31/07/15 01:58, D Wyatt wrote: I just read in a book a little while ago that ** trumps a negative sign? I am struggling with the audacity of that as -1 is negative 1, NOT minus 1. How can an arithmetic operation trump an attribute of a negative integer? Because Python is a programming lang

Re: [Tutor] a puzzle about -3**2 vs (-3)**2

2015-07-31 Thread Todd
On Fri, Jul 31, 2015 at 2:58 AM, D Wyatt wrote: > I just read in a book a little while ago that ** trumps a negative > sign? I am struggling with the audacity of that as -1 is negative 1, > NOT minus 1. How can an arithmetic operation trump an attribute of a > negative integer? It truly makes

Re: [Tutor] a puzzle about -3**2 vs (-3)**2

2015-07-31 Thread Jose Amoreira
Hello! On 07/31/2015 01:58 AM, D Wyatt wrote: I just read in a book a little while ago that ** trumps a negative sign? I am struggling with the audacity of that as -1 is negative 1, NOT minus 1. I'm not sure about what you mean by "trumps", but the square of negative one is positive one (nega

Re: [Tutor] a puzzle about -3**2 vs (-3)**2

2015-07-31 Thread Válas Péter
2015-07-31 2:58 GMT+02:00 D Wyatt : > > >>> 3**2 > 9 > >>> (-3)**2 > 9 > >>> -3**2 > -9 > >>> > > Try to get any other result for these operations in a primary school paper, and then have a look at your marks... ___ Tutor maillist - Tutor@python.org To

Re: [Tutor] a puzzle about -3**2 vs (-3)**2

2015-07-31 Thread Alan Gauld
On 31/07/15 10:55, Jose Amoreira wrote: Given the precedence rules already mentioned by Alan and Todd, the results of the operations you showed us are exactly as expected. You'll get the same results if you try with a pocket calculator or using any other programming language or scientific packag

Re: [Tutor] a puzzle about -3**2 vs (-3)**2

2015-07-31 Thread Jose Amoreira
On 07/31/2015 11:36 AM, Alan Gauld wrote: On 31/07/15 10:55, Jose Amoreira wrote: Given the precedence rules already mentioned by Alan and Todd, the results of the operations you showed us are exactly as expected. You'll get the same results if you try with a pocket calculator or using any othe

Re: [Tutor] a puzzle about -3**2 vs (-3)**2

2015-07-31 Thread Steven D'Aprano
On Thu, Jul 30, 2015 at 05:58:27PM -0700, D Wyatt wrote: > I just read in a book a little while ago that ** trumps a negative > sign? Correct. Exponentiation has higher priority than subtraction, addition, multiplication and division: 2+3**2 => 11 not 25 10-3**2 => 1 not 49 2*3**2 => 18 not

Re: [Tutor] String Attribute

2015-07-31 Thread ltc.hotspot
Hi Alan, Here is the revised code below: fname = raw_input("Enter file name: ") if len(fname) < 1 : fname = "mbox-short.txt" fh = open(fname) count = 0 for line in fh: if not line.startswith('From'): continue line2 = line.strip() line3 = line2.split() line4 = line3[1]

[Tutor] Python application with same name as its corresponding project

2015-07-31 Thread Anthony DuPont
I am trying to setup my python application in a more standard way. In my research, the general recommendation seems to be that if my application is called projectgendocs, here is an acceptable structure: ProjectParent |-- bin/ | |-- projectgendocs.py | |-- projectgendocs | |-- unittest | | |--

Re: [Tutor] String Attribute

2015-07-31 Thread Alan Gauld
On 31/07/15 15:39, ltc.hots...@gmail.com wrote: fname = raw_input("Enter file name: ") if len(fname) < 1 : fname = "mbox-short.txt" fh = open(fname) count = 0 for line in fh: if not line.startswith('From'): continue line2 = line.strip() line3 = line2.split() line4 = line3[1]

Re: [Tutor] String Attribute

2015-07-31 Thread Martin A. Brown
Greetings again Hal, Thank you for posting your small amounts of code and results inline. Thanks for also including clear questions. Your "surface" still seems to add extra space, so, if you could trim that, you may get even more responses from others who are on the Tutor mailing list. Now

Re: [Tutor] a puzzle about -3**2 vs (-3)**2

2015-07-31 Thread Válas Péter
2015-07-31 19:23 GMT+02:00 D Wyatt : > > Try to get any other result for these operations in a primary school > paper, > > and then have a look at your marks... > > > > Condescending and unhelpful response. Why did you bother? > > I tell you another way. These ARE the arithmetically correct resul

Re: [Tutor] Python application with same name as its corresponding project

2015-07-31 Thread Chris Warrick
On 31 July 2015 at 17:13, Anthony DuPont wrote: > I am trying to setup my python application in a more standard way. In my > research, the general recommendation seems to be that if my application is > called projectgendocs, here is an acceptable structure: > > ProjectParent > |-- bin/ > | |-- pr

Re: [Tutor] a puzzle about -3**2 vs (-3)**2

2015-07-31 Thread Alan Gauld
On 31/07/15 18:08, D Wyatt wrote: > It looks odd to us but that's not the point, its how the language works. > You learn to get used to it. Most languages have some idiosyncrasies like > this. Yes, I understand that the creator of the language can make it work however he wants, but I was really

Re: [Tutor] a puzzle about -3**2 vs (-3)**2

2015-07-31 Thread Steven D'Aprano
Hi Deb, On Fri, Jul 31, 2015 at 10:48:57AM -0700, D Wyatt wrote: > I have never really thought about any of this before, but many of you > have responded like this is so obvious. That is not helpful. I'm > looking at a negative number as being an object that is one less than > zero, and the una

Re: [Tutor] a puzzle about -3**2 vs (-3)**2

2015-07-31 Thread D Wyatt
> > He is quite within his rights to do that. It's his language after all. > Some languages solve these problems by not permitting infix notation, > so in Lisp for example > > (3 - 5) > > is illegal, you need to do > > (- 3 5) > > It looks odd to us but that's not the point, its how the language w

Re: [Tutor] a puzzle about -3**2 vs (-3)**2

2015-07-31 Thread D Wyatt
> > Mathematically, this is perfectly acceptable, and what we would > normally expect. In algebra, if we write: > > -x² > > we normally mean the negative of (x squared), not (negative x) squared, > which would be just x². So Python here agrees with standard mathematical > notation. > > > Speaking

Re: [Tutor] a puzzle about -3**2 vs (-3)**2

2015-07-31 Thread D Wyatt
> > This matches the precedence rules for written mathematics, where negation > has a lower precedence than exponentiation as well. So python is doing the > correct thing here mathematically. See, for example, > http://mathforum.org/library/drmath/view/53194.html > __

Re: [Tutor] Python application with same name as its corresponding project

2015-07-31 Thread Japhy Bartlett
Like Chris mentions, usually you don't write your own stuff in /bin/. To make what you've written work anyhow, you can run them from inside /ProjectParent/, not from inside /ProjectParent/bin/. eg, `python bin/projectgendocs.py` On Fri, Jul 31, 2015 at 1:16 PM, Chris Warrick wrote: > On 31 Jul

Re: [Tutor] a puzzle about -3**2 vs (-3)**2

2015-07-31 Thread Válas Péter
2015-07-31 20:51 GMT+02:00 Alan Gauld : > > (For example Forth was designed to fit > into the very small amount of memory left over on an astronomical telescope > control system, so is very, very terse, and uses many "illogical" code > layouts. > Everything was sacrificed to save space.) > Thank

Re: [Tutor] String Attribute

2015-07-31 Thread ltc.hotspot
Hi Martin, Hal is not have a great day, indeed to day: Here is the raw data entered: fname = raw_input("Enter file name: ") if len(fname) < 1 : fname = "mbox-short.txt" fh = open(fname) count = 0 addresses = set() for line in fh: line2 = line.strip() line3 = line2.split() line4 = line3[

Re: [Tutor] a puzzle about -3**2 vs (-3)**2

2015-07-31 Thread Alan Gauld
On 31/07/15 18:48, D Wyatt wrote: I have never really thought about any of this before, but many of you have responded like this is so obvious. That is not helpful. That's a fair point. In our defence I guess that many of the active "tutors" on the list are professional programmers. And pro

Re: [Tutor] String Attribute

2015-07-31 Thread Emile van Sebille
On 7/31/2015 11:57 AM, ltc.hots...@gmail.com wrote: →Question: Why is the list index out of range on line # 9: IndexError Traceback (most recent call last) C:\Users\vm\Desktop\apps\docs\Python\assinment_8_5_v_20.py in () 7 line2 = line.strip() 8 line3 = line2.s

Re: [Tutor] String Attribute

2015-07-31 Thread Alan Gauld
On 31/07/15 19:57, ltc.hots...@gmail.com wrote: for line in fh: line2 = line.strip() line3 = line2.split() line4 = line3[0] You need to check that there actually is something in the list to access. If you get a line with only one word in it, or even a blank line this will fail. addr

Re: [Tutor] String Attribute

2015-07-31 Thread ltc.hotspot
Emile, --> Captured is a printout from line3 to addresses, below: In [46]: print line3 [] In [47]: print line2.split() [] In [48]: print line2 In [49]: print line.strip() In [50]: print fh In [51]: print addresses set(['1.0', 'sou...@collab.sakaiproject.org;', 'Jan', 'mail.umich.ed

Re: [Tutor] String Attribute

2015-07-31 Thread Mark Lawrence
On 31/07/2015 19:57, ltc.hots...@gmail.com wrote: I believe that this is the third time that you've been asked to do something about the amount of whitespace that you're sending to this list. -- My fellow Pythonistas, ask not what our language can do for you, ask what you can do for our langua