I gave up when I started encountering people who thought computer literacy was how to use Word and Excel.
-----Original Message----- From: R-help <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Jeff Newmiller via R-help Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2025 10:17 PM To: Bert Gunter <[email protected]> Cc: [email protected]; Calboli Federico (LUKE) <[email protected]> Subject: Re: [R] [Offlist] Windows standard interface: change working dorectory [External Email] My wife was a returning college student 10 years ago, and her stories to me of her upper division engineering students coping with files and Excel corroborate this deficiency. She was rather more computer-literate than average, but was still apprehensive about piling R on top of her engineering workload at that time. She later did a Master's and finally started using R and has expressed regret that she did not start using it sooner... but I meet engineers all the time who can barely use Excel much less a scripting language. I suspect that ubiquitous GUI programs create a conceptual gap with text-based programming and hierarchical thinking. People are able to skim by all their lives without ever having to organize information.. just type in questions to Google... so why should they start now? On December 11, 2025 6:37:59 PM PST, Bert Gunter <[email protected]> wrote: >I reply as a passive observer and not one with insight or advice. So >certainly no need to respond. > >I am just amazed that in this day and age students of any sort in >higher education institutions of any sort have difficulty understanding >the basics of (the tree structure of) file organization on any sort of >computer. I suspect that this reflects my profound ignorance of how >most of today's young people have interacted with the manifold >computational resources that they use every day through brilliantly >crafted UI's. Still, I would have assumed that such knowledge would be >basic to any "higher education" these days. Silly me... > >Cheers, >Bert > > >On Thu, Dec 11, 2025 at 4:54 PM Robert Baer via R-help ><[email protected]> >wrote: > >> One of the things that has really simplified things for my students >> is using RStudio to run R, and then always creating (working within) >> an RProject. >> >> The location of the RProject becomes the default location (home >> folder) for all related files in the project. It dispenses with >> having to teach the students too much about absolute and relative >> paths, and it is very flexible in the sense that you can move a >> folder from one drive to another or from one computer to another, and >> things still work as long as you start R (RStudio) with the same project >> selected. >> >> I had no end of agony with "path confusion" before using this approach. >> >> Rob >> >> On 12/8/2025 5:22 AM, Calboli Federico (LUKE) wrote: >> > Hello, >> > >> > I need to provide the simplest possible indication to R users with >> either windows or macos machines on how to change working directory. >> Using >> setwd() will not work because I cannot trust them to even understand >> the concept of working directory. >> > >> > On macos it is possible to have a GUI menu (the standard R GUI) >> > that >> would allow the users to "click their way to where their data files >> are", is there such facility for the windows R GUI (the >> out-of-the-box one)? I have no access to windows machines, so I >> cannot check, but I am sure some people will use a windows laptop. >> > >> > F >> > >> > >> > -- >> > >> > Federico Calboli >> > >> > Erityisasiantuntija, tutkimusrahoitus >> > >> > Palveluryhm t >> > >> > Luonnonvarakeskus >> > >> > [[alternative HTML version deleted]] >> > >> > >> > ______________________________________________ >> > [email protected] mailing list -- To UNSUBSCRIBE and more, see >> > https://s/ >> > tat.ethz.ch%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fr-help&data=05%7C02%7Ctebert%40u >> > fl.edu%7C9333d27b96684d59385308de392cff35%7C0d4da0f84a314d76ace60a6 >> > 2331e1b84%7C0%7C0%7C639011062598522223%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJF >> > bXB0eU1hcGkiOnRydWUsIlYiOiIwLjAuMDAwMCIsIlAiOiJXaW4zMiIsIkFOIjoiTWF >> > pbCIsIldUIjoyfQ%3D%3D%7C0%7C%7C%7C&sdata=XEwkGlEWJIknFVWCq1D1oCozKv >> > ut3c%2FJJWKC%2BHL9fio%3D&reserved=0 >> > PLEASE do read the posting guide >> https://www/ >> .r-project.org%2Fposting-guide.html&data=05%7C02%7Ctebert%40ufl.edu%7 >> C9333d27b96684d59385308de392cff35%7C0d4da0f84a314d76ace60a62331e1b84% >> 7C0%7C0%7C639011062598568589%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJFbXB0eU1hcGki >> OnRydWUsIlYiOiIwLjAuMDAwMCIsIlAiOiJXaW4zMiIsIkFOIjoiTWFpbCIsIldUIjoyf >> Q%3D%3D%7C0%7C%7C%7C&sdata=WifGgYk%2B7bcwR8r%2FAuRark0xWThNayI0vj3WFV >> k6COk%3D&reserved=0 >> > and provide commented, minimal, self-contained, reproducible code. >> >> -- >> --- >> Robert W. Baer, Ph.D. >> Professor of Physiology >> Kirksville College of Osteopathic Medicine A.T. Still Univerisity of >> Health Sciences >> 800 W. Jefferson St. >> Kirksville, MO 63501 >> >> ______________________________________________ >> [email protected] mailing list -- To UNSUBSCRIBE and more, see >> https://sta/ >> t.ethz.ch%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fr-help&data=05%7C02%7Ctebert%40ufl.e >> du%7C9333d27b96684d59385308de392cff35%7C0d4da0f84a314d76ace60a62331e1 >> b84%7C0%7C0%7C639011062598595046%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJFbXB0eU1h >> cGkiOnRydWUsIlYiOiIwLjAuMDAwMCIsIlAiOiJXaW4zMiIsIkFOIjoiTWFpbCIsIldUI >> joyfQ%3D%3D%7C0%7C%7C%7C&sdata=kqKyl6Igc6uG2B7c%2FwrGQl%2FUnFE2MXsW5i >> SR3Xymng8%3D&reserved=0 >> PLEASE do read the posting guide >> https://www/ >> .r-project.org%2Fposting-guide.html&data=05%7C02%7Ctebert%40ufl.edu%7 >> C9333d27b96684d59385308de392cff35%7C0d4da0f84a314d76ace60a62331e1b84% >> 7C0%7C0%7C639011062598620415%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJFbXB0eU1hcGki >> OnRydWUsIlYiOiIwLjAuMDAwMCIsIlAiOiJXaW4zMiIsIkFOIjoiTWFpbCIsIldUIjoyf >> Q%3D%3D%7C0%7C%7C%7C&sdata=4KaTZA5tt1AHn35kMYXg3vsiMf4McVsXKSZswI6697 >> k%3D&reserved=0 and provide commented, minimal, self-contained, >> reproducible code. >> > > [[alternative HTML version deleted]] > >______________________________________________ >[email protected] mailing list -- To UNSUBSCRIBE and more, see >https://stat/. >ethz.ch%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fr-help&data=05%7C02%7Ctebert%40ufl.edu%7 >C9333d27b96684d59385308de392cff35%7C0d4da0f84a314d76ace60a62331e1b84%7C >0%7C0%7C639011062598650695%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJFbXB0eU1hcGkiOnRy >dWUsIlYiOiIwLjAuMDAwMCIsIlAiOiJXaW4zMiIsIkFOIjoiTWFpbCIsIldUIjoyfQ%3D%3 >D%7C0%7C%7C%7C&sdata=%2FeJyDip2xE3Ohyb7YM1h4zZbVEXEq%2BRnYQ3w7NsPJaA%3D >&reserved=0 PLEASE do read the posting guide >https://www.r/ >-project.org%2Fposting-guide.html&data=05%7C02%7Ctebert%40ufl.edu%7C933 >3d27b96684d59385308de392cff35%7C0d4da0f84a314d76ace60a62331e1b84%7C0%7C >0%7C639011062598676440%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJFbXB0eU1hcGkiOnRydWUs >IlYiOiIwLjAuMDAwMCIsIlAiOiJXaW4zMiIsIkFOIjoiTWFpbCIsIldUIjoyfQ%3D%3D%7C >0%7C%7C%7C&sdata=%2FprLxyOhs1A0BRLx0w8CzcIzrlF0CbR59w%2FhUAQpuDQ%3D&res >erved=0 and provide commented, minimal, self-contained, reproducible >code. -- Sent from my phone. Please excuse my brevity. [[alternative HTML version deleted]] ______________________________________________ [email protected] mailing list -- To UNSUBSCRIBE and more, see https://stat.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/r-help PLEASE do read the posting guide https://www.r-project.org/posting-guide.html and provide commented, minimal, self-contained, reproducible code. ______________________________________________ [email protected] mailing list -- To UNSUBSCRIBE and more, see https://stat.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/r-help PLEASE do read the posting guide https://www.R-project.org/posting-guide.html and provide commented, minimal, self-contained, reproducible code.
