On Wed, Dec 19, 2018 at 9:32 AM Ilia Mirkin <imir...@alum.mit.edu> wrote:
> On Wed, Dec 19, 2018 at 10:25 AM Matt Turner <matts...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > > On Wed, Dec 19, 2018 at 8:06 AM Ilia Mirkin <imir...@alum.mit.edu> > wrote: > > > > > > On Wed, Dec 19, 2018 at 1:01 AM Matt Turner <matts...@gmail.com> > wrote: > > > > WTF would you have us do? > > > > > > Same thing as for any change with an impact this wide -- > > > > > > 1. Identify stakeholders. In this case, probably the sub-project > > > maintainers, major contributors, and a smattering of distro > > > maintainers. > > > 2. Make them happy, or at least get them, as a group, to agree that > > > it's "good enough". > > > > So we're trying to get better coverage than what you're suggesting. > > > > > 3. Apply. > > > > > > This is the point at which you can make autotools less visible. We're > > > not at that point yet. > > > > Ilia, it's an extra flag. I think you'll survive. > > It's an advertising strategy for meson (hello world, check this out, > it's going to be the default soon). It can be done at the final stage. > We're not at that stage. > > We're at the stage of "hello community, we'd like to replace > autotools", and the community coming back to you with feedback. > I disagree. I think we were at that stage 6-8 months ago and a bunch of the community didn't come back with feedback until we sent a patch to delete autotools. Identify stakeholders? Done; the distros are all cool with it or have already switched. Agree it's "good enough"? We thought we'd done that and then people raised issues at the 11th hour. Even with those issues, the ones that are real issues with meson are all in-progress to fix. The others are just "make it look like autotools so I can pretend meson doesn't exist". Please pardon my frustration but we thought we'd done our due diligence and it wasn't until we took a step very much like this one that we actually got feedback from certain people such as yourself. To say that we're only now getting to the "hello community, we'd like to replace autotools" stage is a bit disingenuous. That said, that doesn't mean I think this patch is the right way to go. I think the referenced e-mail conversaion has flushed out enough of the remaining issues that we need to fix a couple of remaining things in meson and then just delete autotools. Maybe this means that autotools stays around for one more release but then I think we should just can it without bothering with the extra deprecation step. --Jason
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