Which table would I look at? Also, Manu:Job queue <https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Job_queue#Updating_links_tables_when_a_template_changes> says "When a template changes, MediaWiki adds a job to the job queue for each article transcluding that template" which is contradicting what we already agreed on. And also making me wonder why 1000+ jobs were not created when I edited a template with that many transclusions.
On Sun, May 24, 2015 at 1:56 PM, John <[email protected]> wrote: > If you have database access you can look at job timestamp to get an idea > > On Sunday, May 24, 2015, Huji Lee <[email protected]> wrote: > > > Ok, got it. > > > > Is there anyway to get a sense of how fast/slow jobs are being executed > on > > a wiki? For instance, on English Wikipedia, I can see how many jobs are > in > > the query using the API, but can I get a sense of the average time it > gets > > for a job to run? > > > > On Sun, May 24, 2015 at 9:22 AM, John <[email protected] > > <javascript:;>> wrote: > > > > > Editing the template adds 1? Job to the queue that then updates > > everything. > > > If needed you can run/schedule runjobs.php in the maintenance folder. I > > > know smaller wikis sometimes have issues with the jobs not getting > > executed > > > fast enough > > > > > > On Sunday, May 24, 2015, Huji Lee <[email protected] <javascript:;>> > > wrote: > > > > > > > Great answers. > > > > > > > > Here is a follow up question though: I edited a template used in > > > thousands > > > > of pages, yet the Job Queue for that wiki did NOT increase by a > factor > > of > > > > thousand. It simply increased from around 10 to around 30. And since > > then > > > > (several days ago), the associated page links are not updated. I > > > understand > > > > that Job Queue is not easy to comprehend, but can you shed a light as > > to > > > > why the job queue only grow that much, and why the links haven't been > > > > updated since? (Note that job queue very quickly shrank to 10 or so > > > again). > > > > > > > > On Sun, May 24, 2015 at 8:47 AM, John <[email protected] > > <javascript:;> > > > > <javascript:;>> wrote: > > > > > > > > > When editing a template the resulting link updates go thru the Job > > > Queue > > > > > https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Job_queue which has a lot of > > > > > variables which determine the speed that jobs get executed. > > > > > > > > > > When you perform a null edit the page is reparsed, resulting in > > updates > > > > to > > > > > the link related tables (iwlink, external_links, page_links ect) > > which > > > is > > > > > what the whatlinks here results. Normally the job queue forces a > > > reparse > > > > as > > > > > needed. > > > > > > > > > > a standard purge does not update the table, however a > forcelinkupdate > > > > added > > > > > to the purge URL will achieve the same thing see > > > > > > > https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Parameters_to_index.php#Actions > > > > > > > > > > As for job queue numbers, dont try and understand it, its a > confusing > > > > mess. > > > > > A single job might affect many pages, might or might not spawn more > > > jobs > > > > > and several other variable actions > > > > > > > > > > On Sun, May 24, 2015 at 8:35 AM, Huji Lee <[email protected] > > <javascript:;> > > > > <javascript:;>> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > I have a number of related questions regarding MediaWiki's > caching > > > > > > mechanism. I would be grateful if one could answer these please. > > The > > > > > > assumption here is that a wiki is configured using the exact same > > > > caching > > > > > > methods that Wikimedia uses. > > > > > > > > > > > > Please feel free to provide links to https://www.mediawiki.org > as > > > well > > > > > as > > > > > > https://noc.wikimedia.org when specifying configuration > variables > > in > > > > > your > > > > > > answers as I am sure this would benefit future readers of this > > thread > > > > as > > > > > > well. > > > > > > > > > > > > Q1: Page [[foo]] contains template {{bar}}. I edit that template, > > but > > > > the > > > > > > page is not immediately updated. If I don't manually purge the > > cache > > > of > > > > > > that page, how long would it take for the page cache to be > updated? > > > > Which > > > > > > variable sets that time? And what is the value of that variable > > > > currently > > > > > > at Wikimedia wikis? > > > > > > > > > > > > Q2: Page [[foo]] contains template {{bar}}, and that template > > > provides > > > > a > > > > > > link to page [[norf]]. I edit the template such that it instead > > links > > > > to > > > > > > page [[qux]]. However, when I go to Special:WhatLinksHere/norf I > > > still > > > > > see > > > > > > [[foo]] listed. Even if I try ?action=purge on [[foo]], that > > behavior > > > > > > doesn't change. The only way to change it is either to edit > [[foo]] > > > and > > > > > > change its content, or to simply go to the edit page of [[foo]] > and > > > > save > > > > > > without changes. > > > > > > > > > > > > Q2.A: If I don't do that null edit, how long would it take for > the > > > page > > > > > > cache to be updated? Which variable sets that time? And what is > the > > > > value > > > > > > of that variable currently at Wikimedia wikis? > > > > > > > > > > > > Q2.B: Why is it that ?action=purge doesn't update the pagelinks > > > table? > > > > > > > > > > > > Q2.C: Why is it that saving a page without any edits triggers any > > > > update > > > > > > mechanism? (I would assume it'd be less costly overall to say "if > > > diff > > > > is > > > > > > null, don't do anything at all"; this question is more > > philosophical: > > > > why > > > > > > would we not like the quoted behavior? > > > > > > > > > > > > Q2.D: Does the Special:WhatLinksHere results come from a cache? > In > > > > other > > > > > > words, if I query the database directly right after I change the > > > > template > > > > > > (as mentioned in Q2) but before I do any null edits, would it > still > > > > show > > > > > > the old page link from [[foo]] to [[norf]]? Or would it show the > > > > correct > > > > > > link from [[foo]] to [[qux]] while Special:WhatLinksHere is still > > > > showing > > > > > > the old link? > > > > > > > > > > > > Q2.E: Is it possible to induce the same "resolution" through API? > > > That > > > > > is, > > > > > > is it possible to try to save a page without any changes to its > > > content > > > > > via > > > > > > API, and thereby forcefully update the page links entries for > that > > > > page? > > > > > > > > > > > > Q3: Assume that 100 pages contain template {{bar}}, and that > > template > > > > > > provides a link to page [[norf]]. I edit the template such that > it > > > > > instead > > > > > > links to page [[qux]]. Would that add any jobs to the job queue? > If > > > > yes, > > > > > > how many? Should I expect 100 new jobs to be added, because 100 > > page > > > > > > cache's need updating? > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks in advance, > > > > > > > > > > > > Huji > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > > > MediaWiki-l mailing list > > > > > > To unsubscribe, go to: > > > > > > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/mediawiki-l > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > > MediaWiki-l mailing list > > > > > To unsubscribe, go to: > > > > > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/mediawiki-l > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > MediaWiki-l mailing list > > > > To unsubscribe, go to: > > > > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/mediawiki-l > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > MediaWiki-l mailing list > > > To unsubscribe, go to: > > > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/mediawiki-l > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > MediaWiki-l mailing list > > To unsubscribe, go to: > > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/mediawiki-l > > > _______________________________________________ > MediaWiki-l mailing list > To unsubscribe, go to: > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/mediawiki-l > _______________________________________________ MediaWiki-l mailing list To unsubscribe, go to: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/mediawiki-l
