It's not the servers (that already exist) are the problem. It's that the already existing playerbase is constantly reduced.
I want servers to flourish by using what's available, not by cutting down large server owners. That's backwards logic. On Sat, Jan 25, 2014 at 12:42 AM, Nerdboy <[email protected]> wrote: > No I mean you, as the big dogs, are part of the problem and should > scale back your networks if you're concerned about the little guy. > > On 1/24/14, Doctor McKay <[email protected]> wrote: >> So newcomers need to face the "big dogs" with hundreds of servers with >> their one server? >> >> >> Dr. McKay >> www.doctormckay.com >> >> >> On Fri, Jan 24, 2014 at 6:35 PM, Nerdboy <[email protected]> wrote: >> >>> An easy solution to allow newcomers to get more traffic would be to >>> reduce the number of servers you run. That way quickplay traffic is >>> distributed more evenly rather than "who bought the most rack space?" >>> >>> On 1/24/14, Valentin G. <[email protected]> wrote: >>> > Then explain how should people remedy this situation? >>> > >>> > Not every community can retroactively join the master race and >>> > suddenly be around for 6 years and have a great playerbase out of thin >>> > air. Yes, there are servers that currently rely on quickplay. So what >>> > if 50% is QP traffic. That's still 50% of players that are returning. >>> > In order to increase that percentage of returning players we still >>> > *need* to have the other 50%. If people don't even come to your server >>> > in the first place (by being in the 50% QP population) there is not >>> > even the *chance* of them staying around. >>> > >>> > This is the model when you use QP. Use the system, deliver an >>> > experience that continuously moves the split towards a healthy, >>> > returning player base. Of course it would be great if players still >>> > went around the server browser and naturally found out about new >>> > servers and stayed there. Since that doesn't happen anymore, newer >>> > communities have to rely on quickplay. That's simply how it works. >>> > It's really great for all the people here that have a long history in >>> > their community and a stable and returning playerbase already. Not >>> > everyone can enjoy that, and you are trying to prevent them from even >>> > having the ability to achieve that. >>> > >>> > I really hope one day people get that into their thick heads. There >>> > are start-ups that haven't been around since the TF2 beta. They *can >>> > not* have as healthy of a playerbase as you already have. Don't talk >>> > them down because of that, and even applaud Valve when every chance of >>> > building up their community is ripped from their hands. >>> > >>> > On Sat, Jan 25, 2014 at 12:14 AM, Gordon Reynolds >>> > <[email protected]> wrote: >>> >> Maybe there is a point to take from this. >>> >> >>> >> Maybe the kind of people who played TF2 pre-F2P era, aren't the same >>> >> people >>> >> who want to play TF2 now? >>> >> >>> >> Demographics change, if you think the same type of people pick up TF2 >>> >> today >>> >> as the ones who paid money to pick it up pre-F2P, you might be in for >>> >> a >>> >> bit >>> >> of a shock. Or not, look at your numbers, 50% of your population is >>> >> just >>> >> there because that's where they ended up, they didn't choose to be on >>> >> your >>> >> server. >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> On Fri, Jan 24, 2014 at 3:10 PM, Doctor McKay <[email protected]> >>> >> wrote: >>> >> >>> >>> Find me a vanilla server that remains populated without the help of >>> >>> Quickplay. They don't exist. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Dr. McKay >>> >>> www.doctormckay.com >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> On Fri, Jan 24, 2014 at 6:07 PM, Gordon Reynolds < >>> >>> [email protected]> wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> > So if you've had a server for a few years and you still get 47% >>> >>> > quickplay >>> >>> > traffic doesn't that tell you that you're running a server that >>> >>> > might >>> >>> > be >>> >>> > twice as large as it needs to be? I mean if you pulled regulars >>> >>> > from >>> >>> > quickplay players wouldn't that number slowly drop (during peak), >>> >>> > because >>> >>> > of all your regulars? >>> >>> > >>> >>> > Or do quickplayer honestly, literally, -not care what server they >>> >>> > are >>> >>> on-, >>> >>> > and will never add your server to favorites as is? >>> >>> > >>> >>> > >>> >>> > On Thu, Jan 23, 2014 at 8:11 PM, Doctor McKay >>> >>> > <[email protected] >>> > >>> >>> > wrote: >>> >>> > >>> >>> > > The cvar was actually added at the request of myself and several >>> >>> others. >>> >>> > > >>> >>> > > I took the liberty to make a chart showing exactly what percent >>> >>> > > of >>> >>> > > my >>> >>> > > players come from Quickplay. The result was disappointingly high: >>> >>> > > http://i.imgur.com/91xNnU1.png >>> >>> > > >>> >>> > > I don't expect any more than 20% of Quickplay users to uncheck >>> >>> > > the >>> >>> > > "Official servers only" box. That means that I have lost around >>> >>> > > 40% >>> >>> > > of >>> >>> my >>> >>> > > traffic. My community is relatively popular, too. Smaller >>> >>> > > communities >>> >>> or >>> >>> > > communities that are just starting up will lose a lot more >>> >>> > > traffic >>> >>> than I >>> >>> > > will. >>> >>> > > >>> >>> > > >>> >>> > > Dr. McKay >>> >>> > > www.doctormckay.com >>> >>> > > >>> >>> > > >>> >>> > > On Thu, Jan 23, 2014 at 10:48 PM, Robert Paulson < >>> >>> [email protected] >>> >>> > > >wrote: >>> >>> > > >>> >>> > > > It's quite obvious really. Valve only makes features to benefit >>> >>> > > themselves >>> >>> > > > or players, and cl_connectmethod was at face value did not do >>> >>> > > > either >>> >>> > one. >>> >>> > > > >>> >>> > > > They don't care about server owners having this knowledge >>> >>> > > > unless >>> >>> > > > it >>> >>> > > > benefits them and didn't even bother to protect the convar from >>> >>> > spoofing >>> >>> > > by >>> >>> > > > a using 1 convar flag. >>> >>> > > > >>> >>> > > > Its main purpose was to stop server owners from complaining >>> >>> > > > about >>> >>> > > > all >>> >>> > the >>> >>> > > > restrictions placed on quickplay on the flawed assumption that >>> >>> > quickplay >>> >>> > > is >>> >>> > > > a tiny and unimportant part of your player base. >>> >>> > > > >>> >>> > > > >>> >>> > > > >>> >>> > > > On Thu, Jan 23, 2014 at 7:20 PM, Doctor McKay >>> >>> > > > <[email protected] >>> >>> > >>> >>> > > > wrote: >>> >>> > > > >>> >>> > > > > While I agree with what you are saying, what does >>> >>> > > > > cl_connectmethod >>> >>> > have >>> >>> > > > to >>> >>> > > > > do with any of this? >>> >>> > > > > On Jan 23, 2014 9:12 PM, "Robert Paulson" >>> >>> > > > > <[email protected]> >>> >>> > > wrote: >>> >>> > > > > >>> >>> > > > > > First they came for the custom attachments, and I did not >>> >>> > > > > > speak >>> >>> > out. >>> >>> > > > > > Because I did not use it. >>> >>> > > > > > Then they came for fast respawn, and I did not speak out. >>> >>> Because I >>> >>> > > did >>> >>> > > > > not >>> >>> > > > > > use it. >>> >>> > > > > > Then they came for increased slots, and I did not speak >>> >>> > > > > > out. >>> >>> > Because >>> >>> > > I >>> >>> > > > > did >>> >>> > > > > > not use it. >>> >>> > > > > > Then they came for the MOTD, and I did not speak out. >>> >>> > > > > > Because >>> >>> > > > > > it >>> >>> > > would >>> >>> > > > > hurt >>> >>> > > > > > others more than me. >>> >>> > > > > > Then they came for me, and there was no one left to speak >>> >>> > > > > > for >>> >>> > > > > > me. >>> >>> > > > > > >>> >>> > > > > > This is a repeat of the "Custom Tabs" fiasco. Except Valve >>> >>> probably >>> >>> > > > won't >>> >>> > > > > > remove it this time because they can wave the evidence that >>> >>> > > > > > a >>> >>> > > minority >>> >>> > > > of >>> >>> > > > > > players use quickplay, despite the fact that quickplay has >>> >>> > > > > > a >>> >>> > monopoly >>> >>> > > > on >>> >>> > > > > > new players and without them your server is dead. Your >>> current >>> >>> > > players >>> >>> > > > > > won't play TF2 forever. >>> >>> > > > > > >>> >>> > > > > > I saw this coming a mile away when Valve released the >>> >>> > > cl_connectmethod >>> >>> > > > > > convar. As I have said time and time again, Valve has >>> >>> > > > > > obligations >>> >>> > to >>> >>> > > > > server >>> >>> > > > > > owners as well as players. We, or at least I, bought TF2 >>> >>> expecting >>> >>> > > not >>> >>> > > > > to >>> >>> > > > > > have our hosting abilities crippled so much. >>> >>> > > > > > >>> >>> > > > > > On Thu, Jan 23, 2014 at 5:11 PM, Doctor McKay < >>> >>> > [email protected] >>> >>> > > > >>> >>> > > > > > wrote: >>> >>> > > > > > >>> >>> > > > > > > Why? >>> >>> > > > > > > >>> >>> > > > > > > Adding a "Valve servers only" checkbox (that's checked by >>> >>> > default) >>> >>> > > is >>> >>> > > > > > going >>> >>> > > > > > > to hurt enough (and only those communities that are >>> >>> > > > > > > playing >>> >>> > > > > > > by >>> >>> > the >>> >>> > > > > rules; >>> >>> > > > > > > cheating communities will just steal *more* traffic from >>> the >>> >>> > > > legitimate >>> >>> > > > > > > communities). >>> >>> > > > > > > >>> >>> > > > > > > It's now all but impossible to try to retain a client who >>> >>> joined >>> >>> > > via >>> >>> > > > > > > Quickplay (and those are the clients we *need* to >>> >>> > > > > > > retain). >>> >>> > > > > > > We >>> >>> > can't >>> >>> > > > > show >>> >>> > > > > > > them our website. We can't even allow them to use a menu >>> >>> > > > > > > to >>> >>> jump >>> >>> > to >>> >>> > > > > > another >>> >>> > > > > > > one of our servers anymore. >>> >>> > > > > > > >>> >>> > > > > > > Please think about what you're doing. If your intention >>> >>> > > > > > > is >>> >>> > > > > > > to >>> >>> > harm >>> >>> > > > the >>> >>> > > > > > good >>> >>> > > > > > > communities, you're doing a fine job at it. >>> >>> > > > > > > >>> >>> > > > > > > Dr. McKay >>> >>> > > > > > > www.doctormckay.com >>> >>> > > > > > > _______________________________________________ >>> >>> > > > > > > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the >>> list >>> >>> > > > archives, >>> >>> > > > > > > please visit: >>> >>> > > > > > > >>> >>> > https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux >>> >>> > > > > > > >>> >>> > > > > > _______________________________________________ >>> >>> > > > > > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the >>> >>> > > > > > list >>> >>> > > archives, >>> >>> > > > > > please visit: >>> >>> > > > > > >>> >>> https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux >>> >>> > > > > > >>> >>> > > > > _______________________________________________ >>> >>> > > > > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list >>> >>> > archives, >>> >>> > > > > please visit: >>> >>> > > > > >>> https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux >>> >>> > > > > >>> >>> > > > _______________________________________________ >>> >>> > > > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list >>> >>> archives, >>> >>> > > > please visit: >>> >>> > > > >>> https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux >>> >>> > > > >>> >>> > > _______________________________________________ >>> >>> > > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list >>> >>> > > archives, >>> >>> > > please visit: >>> >>> > > https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux >>> >>> > > >>> >>> > _______________________________________________ >>> >>> > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list >>> archives, >>> >>> > please visit: >>> >>> > https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux >>> >>> > >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> >>> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list >>> >>> archives, >>> >>> please visit: >>> >>> https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux >>> >>> >>> >> _______________________________________________ >>> >> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, >>> >> please visit: >>> >> https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux >>> > >>> > _______________________________________________ >>> > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, >>> > please visit: >>> > https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux >>> > >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, >>> please visit: >>> https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux >>> >> _______________________________________________ >> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, >> please visit: >> https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux >> > > _______________________________________________ > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please > visit: > https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux _______________________________________________ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
