On Wed, Feb 19, 2014 at 1:04 AM, Daniel Campbell <li...@sporkbox.us> wrote: > On 02/18/2014 12:14 PM, Canek Peláez Valdés wrote: >> On Tue, Feb 18, 2014 at 12:07 PM, Andrew Savchenko <birc...@gmail.com> wrote: >>> On Tue, 18 Feb 2014 11:22:23 -0600 Canek Peláez Valdés wrote: >>>>> Yet again, I respect ones right to use whatever one wants, but I ask >>>>> to respect mine as well. That's why I propose a separate systemd >>>>> profile for those willing to use it. >>>> >>>> Then write. Just be aware that to write a systemd profile, you need to >>>> use systemd. >>> >>> Or to create a non-systemd profile :) >> >> That's the best response I've read in, like, many years. That's >> perfect; I'm 100% behind it. I even volunteer to help (with testing) >> to anyone going for this. >> >> You guys create a systemd-sucks-we-dont-want-it profile, and I promise >> to give you guys a hand. >> >> Make a profile that "frees" users from using systemd, and I think even >> several Gentoo developers will get behind that. >> >> Now we are talking; this has been my whole point the whole time. >> Everybody that don't want to use systemd; help this idea, and if there >> are enough of you, you'll pulled through. >> >> Regards. >> > > For such a profile to be legitimate, systemd would have to be chosen as > the default. Gentoo is one of the last bastions of choice available to > GNU/Linux users and it would create a complete shitstorm if systemd were > pushed on Gentoo's users. You're just trying to push systemd on one of > the few distros that doesn't use it by default. Do you hang out with > John Paul Adrian Glaubitz? He's a Debian developer who has a > long-running history of pushing systemd as well. There is nothing wrong > with systemd as a choice, but to push it as the default is ridiculous. > systemd can have its own profile while the rest of the world goes on > without it. Everybody wins.
For the record, and being completely honest (I've always been), at some point, yeah, I would like for the devs to discuss the idea of systemd as default init system. It does not depends on me though; the devs (and the council they elect) will take such decision, and the discussion (if it happens) will be in a long, long time. But my (previous) push for a systemd-sucks profile was because I sincerely believe that the burden of work should be on the ones proposing *any* profile, and to support a systemd profile you *need* to use systemd, and then it makes no sense that the people that *don't want* systemd need to do the work for a systemd profile. However, after Andreas K. Huettel pointed out (in [1]) how simple and minimal a systemd profile actually is[2], I changed my mind. I now wholeheartedly support a systemd profile, since is so small, that the burden of work is basically negligible, and apparently the same GNOME/systemd Gentoo developers are already doing it. So, I think, everybody agrees now. Lets have a systemd profile. (I mean, the work to have it apparently it's already done, so it does not matter what I, or anyone here, argues about it). > For all this talk about technical details, nobody seems to notice the > marketing that's going on and frankly it disgusts me. There is no marketing; no one is selling nothing. We are just discussing different technologies and their merits (or demerits), according to what each one of us knows/believe. It's interesting, it's fun, we learn things (I learned about the systemd profile in existence) and it changes absolutely nothing about Linux, Gentoo, or the status of systemd anywhere. To change Linux, Gentoo, or the status of systemd somewhere, people need to contribute code, testing or documentation, not post arguments in mailing lists. But again, it's fun (except for a couple of trolls), so no harm is done. Regards. [1] http://article.gmane.org/gmane.linux.gentoo.user/272668 [2] http://sources.gentoo.org/cgi-bin/viewvc.cgi/gentoo-x86/profiles/targets/systemd/ -- Canek Peláez Valdés Posgrado en Ciencia e Ingeniería de la Computación Universidad Nacional Autónoma de México
