Right - then Incubator guidance really needs updated, because reading it, it sounds like using the IPMC as a sponsor is a special case for when you really could not find a sponsor project. Going over the list of incubating project this hasn't really been the case this decade except for a couple of clear sub-projects.
http://incubator.apache.org/incubation/Process_Description.html even links to exactly to the umbrella project Jakarta. I removed the confusing Jakarta reference and have updated it slightly - see staging: http://incubator.staging.apache.org/incubation/Process_Description.html .. but more work is needed as it still describes the process as normally sending proposals directly to the champion project, where IPMC submission is a special case. So I agree with you that it is now the other way around. (Also please remember people won't know jargon like "IPMC" at this stage..) I added these paragraphs to help explain what the champion will help you with before you write and submit a proposal - we found that very useful for our proposal and for understanding what Apache and "Apache Way" really would mean for us and our project. > Simply email that person directly (e.g. usern...@apache.org, see the > committer list to find the username), describe informally yourselves and your > project, and ask kindly if she would be willing to act as your Champion for > your project within the Apache incubator. Remember that all Apache Committers > and Members are volunteers with limited spare time, but you will hopefully > find that the person is honoured by your request to be a Champion and sees a > potential for your project as a future Apache project. > Once you have found an eligible person who is willing to act as Champion, you > can use this person to help you determine if and how your proposal can fit > within the ASF, and if the "Apache Way" of open development would be right > for your project. This might happen over a series of emails, telephone calls > or online chat sessions, and should cover any practical concerns such as > project infrastructure (e.g. mailing lists, web, source code repositories, > issue tracker, wiki) but also the implications of licensing, governance and > Intellectual Property management. I have not updated from section "Acceptance" and beyond to make Incubator as Champion the default. - any takers? :) Or should larger parts of Process_Description.html be removed as it is also covered by the much nicer http://incubator.apache.org/guides/proposal.html? (which on the other hand doesn't say much about where you find a Champion and Sponsor). On 16 January 2015 at 16:21, Benson Margulies <bimargul...@gmail.com> wrote: > On Fri, Jan 16, 2015 at 10:39 AM, Stian Soiland-Reyes <st...@apache.org> > wrote: >> Relating to IncubatorV2 and pTLP proposals - on Apache Commons I seem >> to have spurred a discussion about making sub-mailing lists (And thus >> forming sub-communities) - but keep the formalities on the general >> list. >> >> (email below) >> http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/commons-dev/201501.mbox/%3C23d5b03fc1cdb4079ceb52c55458f0e3%40scarlet.be%3E >> >> >> My slight concern (even though I would benefit from the proposal :)) >> is that this is in danger of forming a "mini incubator" with less >> clear guidance and follow-up: >> >> http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/commons-dev/201501.mbox/%3CCAPRnXt%3DDwqk9p-b-yYBYRnrp%3DanvLgdTanMkenLfm6fGQgcHfw%40mail.gmail.com%3E >> >> >> The pTLP proposal has not mentioned what would be the process for >> projects with a sponsor different from Incubator (e.g. which don't >> aspire to become TLPs) - presumably they would usually have mentors >> from and report to the parent project? > > Well, the idea of non-incubator sponsors seems to me to have been a > dead letter for years. As of now, the board's expectation is that all > incubating projects are supervised by the IPMC. While the proposal > template still has a slot for sponsor, it does not mean anything in > practice. It's the IPMC and only the IPMC that accepts new projects, > and then supervises them. > > In the very remote case that my version of the pTLP proposal goes > anywhere, the board would, of course, have the option of passing a > resolution to establish a pTLP without prior vetting by the Incubator > Committee. > > As for subcommunities, I reference the very complex process of a few > years back of _getting rid of_ 'umbrella projects.' > >> >> >> I don't see any proposals with "Apache Commons" as the sponsor at >> http://incubator.apache.org/projects/index.html >> >> .. is that because Commons already have a lightweight entry path with >> its sandbox? >> >> https://commons.apache.org/sandbox.html >> >> >> >> ---------- Forwarded message ---------- >> From: Gilles <gil...@harfang.homelinux.org> >> Date: 16 January 2015 at 00:47 >> Subject: [ALL] Too much traffic on the "dev" ML >> To: Commons Developers List <d...@commons.apache.org> >> >> >> Hi. >> >> In the discussion that started about RDF, it seems that the >> traffic volume is a stumbling block. >> [For some time now, it has been a growing nuisance, and the >> usual dismissal about filters won't change the fact: Setting >> up a filter that will redirect stuff to /dev/null is a waste >> of bandwidth.] >> >> If different ML are created, people interested in everything >> can subscribe _once_, and nothing will change for them. >> For people who spend a lot of time just deleting dozens messages >> and notifications a day, it will be a relief. >> >> Maintaining community conversation is not a problem: just >> create an "all-...@commons.apache.org" ML for things that >> need input form a larger audience (like votes). >> >> >> Best regards, >> Gilles >> >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@commons.apache.org >> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@commons.apache.org >> >> -- >> Stian Soiland-Reyes >> Apache Taverna (incubating) >> http://orcid.org/0000-0001-9842-9718 >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org >> For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org >> > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org > -- Stian Soiland-Reyes Apache Taverna (incubating) http://orcid.org/0000-0001-9842-9718 --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
