Dislike. For small projects, PPMC == Committers is a great starting point.
For huge projects like OpenOffice something like this would have been chaos unleashed. If it were 3 or 4 then I would not have volunteered to be a Mentor for Apache Flex. To me the answer should remain somewhere between 1 and 2 - the status quo. Regards, Dave On Nov 20, 2013, at 5:53 PM, Marvin Humphrey wrote: > On Mon, Nov 18, 2013 at 3:41 AM, Andy Seaborne <a...@apache.org> wrote: >> I am concerned that it would be dis-empowering to the incoming community if >> at least the active and major developers of the podling were not on the PPMC >> at the start. > > I don't see how we might divide up an "Initial Committer List" into "active > and major developers" and "everyone else", so I think it's all or nothing. > That gives us four ways to populate the initial PPMC: > > 1. Mentors + Initial Commiter List > 2. Initial Committer List > 3. Mentors > 4. (empty) > > With regards to whether voting in all project contributors is > "dis-empowering", I claim that it is precisely the opposite. Going through > the exercise of bootstrapping the PPMC allows people who are new to the ASF to > become familiar with the ritual of personnel voting, and it provides a > framework for conversations about the "PPMC member" role and its > responsibilities, community development, recruitment and meritocracy. In > contrast, the present system denies ASF novices such practical experience > until a new contributor wanders by. > > To the extent that any dis-empowerment happens under this proposal, it is > exactly the same dis-empowerment which happens today: "active and major > developers" who bring codebases to Apache relinquish control and become one > vote among many on a PMC. Subjecting such individuals to a vote on their > merit (which will surely pass) just reveals the truth to them sooner. > > Perhaps with the truth laid bare, certain projects might not enter the > Incubator. Do we care? Regretful project founders who are unable to let go > have caused our communities a lot of grief, from both inside and outside > Apache. > > Still, this isn't the hill I want to die on. I think that starting with an > empty PPMC is good policy for a variety of reasons, but I'm willing to be > flexible for the sake of building consensus on how to address the truly > damaging dis-empowerment of PPMC members with regards to release votes. If > an empty initial PPMC is a deal breaker for you, does it's removal unblock > your support for the rest of the proposal at <http://s.apache.org/atG>? > > Marvin Humphrey > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org > --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
