You clearly have no clue! Just as an example. - Daniel Kulp from IONA is a Tuscany Committer. Which is a WS PMC sponsored Incubator project - Daniel Diephouse from Envoi working on XFire is a WS Committer as he earned karma on the XmlSchema project.
FWW, Thanks for letting people see your true colors. Geir has always told me that your blog is a Literary device. It's just abundantly clear that it is a farce. I'll let my actions speak for themselves rather than stoop to your level. thanks, dims On 6/23/06, Hani Suleiman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
I'm fairly astounded by the amount of email generated due to my name being on the initial committer list. It is interesting to note that all the people who have objected are those who feel personally offended by some of my writing (specifically, the tomcat and axis2 rants...ironically my tomcat DefaultServlet rant was purely technical and did not degenerate into my usual personal insult comfort zone). I'm sorry that you can't take a little criticism, and while I will happily admit that yes, I did insult you in ways that you probably didn't quite expect, I fully stand by everything I said, and will still insist that Axis2 and Tomcat are awful projects, that are badly written and have only gotten where they are today due to marketing forces, instead of technical merit. I am perplexed that you feel that a dislike of an Apache project merits a membership rejection though. Does everyone at Apache love every project there? If that were the case, then the whole ecosystem is in a far unhealthier state than anyone on the outside might suspect. If Apache people feel that my technical abilities are not relevant, and that what should matter in whether I am allowed in as a cxfire committer is how willing I am to tow the party line, then I shouldn't be on that list. Apache would be the first organisation I've joined (or might have joined) that did not judge me on technical merit; quite an irony considering the whole meritocracy approach that Apache claims. This is, astoundingly, my first experience of being judged not on technical merit, but on random blathering that serves no particular purpose than ranting for ranting's sake. Just to set expectations, I will not stop saying things like 'Apache sucks', because I still do think that many of the processes and members have some terrible flaws. I am not aware of any Apache membership requirements that state that one's freedom of speech and expression are curtailed in any way; it is after all an alleged meritocracy, all that matters is how good the code I check in is, and how well I play within the team I'm a member of. If the cxfire team at any point feels I'm a liability rather than an asset, I would gladly leave. In fact I'd like to think that I'm self-aware enough to leave way before they feel the need to ask me to. I know plenty of Apache members who find many of the processes cumbersome and onerous, yet are still active participants; nobody seems to threaten them with being kicked out. I believe in cxfire, and think it's a superb project. I think competition in this space is healthy, and think it's rather lame that people like dims and sanjiva keep trying to cast doubts on the validity of the project, just because it happens to eat into their projected revenues. It does feel like there's a small amount of hypocrisy going around, where people express concern that cxfire has many IONA people involved, without noticing that most of the objectors are WSO2 people, who (quite rationally) put WSO2 priorities ahead of Apache ones. If there's a policy of only endorsing one technology for any given field within Apache, then sure, cxfire does not belong. If there is space for allowing competing technologies, then I fail to see why xfire choosing to ignore axis2 or not support it has any relevant at all as to whether it can live in Apache or not. I always thought that despite all its flaws, Apache was a great ground for the 'let a thousand flowers bloom' approach, and I am frankly disturbed by how much say commercial interests seem to have in whether projects get accepted or not. In many ways this thread has left me with an even worse impression of Apache than I already had, which is, believe or not, a very sad thing. I'd like to think that Apache is a meritocracy, driven by technology, with no allegiance to commercial interests. It is driven by the concept of open source for the sake of open source; not open source that we can now build a company around and get funding and piss around with in order to make a living to avoid having a real job. Certainly not the latter to the exclusion of the former! On that basis, I cannot conceive of a single good reason for rejecting cxfire. By all criteria that count, it's a successful project, it is widely deployed, it has an active developer base, and an interested and participatory community. So what if it happens to be technically superior to Axis2 (at least, in most people's opinions), is that a reason to reject it? I apologise if I've offended anyone, that was certainly not my intent, in this case. I also apologise for being blunt and undiplomatic, but this thread was too silly and the issues raised too pedantic for me not to stoop to the same level. To the sane people who responded with sensible requests and criticisms, I sincerely apologise, and hope you see my rather long discourse as an heartfelt plea for sanity and objectivity, rather than dismissing it as the ranting of a rather angry random java guy. Regards, Hani --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
-- Davanum Srinivas : http://people.apache.org/~dims/ --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
