+1
> On Aug 31, 2026, at 10:42 AM, Josh McKenzie <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> What do we think about starting with testing and deferring concurrency and
> collections? The two seem to have very different needs in terms of API
> lifecycle and evolution so having a policy tailored to the right balance of
> producer vs. consumer needs makes sense to me.
>
> On Mon, Aug 24, 2026, at 1:11 PM, Josh McKenzie wrote:
>> Can see how that'd come across as a false dichotomy; not my intent or mental
>> model. What I was thinking and shorthanded poorly was - if we said "you need
>> to run CI on all dependents and confirm no regression", that makes utils the
>> single highest-toil place in the ecosystem to get code merged. You'd have to
>> do the A/B triage of your run to a control for every project that consumes
>> it. Definitely not "block on green" - I glossed over that poorly.
>>
>> There's also an opportunity for us to automate LLM-based triage of flaky or
>> failing tests to help burn those down, potentially giving us a state where
>> we actually had green CI ecosystem wide for the first time in over a decade.
>> That'd change the calculus here quite a bit and just make utils merges long
>> / high compute but not a flaky CI nightmare.
>>
>> On Mon, Aug 24, 2026, at 5:36 AM, Mick wrote:
>>>
>>> > 1. full CI pass on everything puts a dependency on us having
>>> > consistently green CI or utils becomes the single worst place to try
>>> > and get something merged in the ecosystem. We haven't had consistent
>>> > green CI in the 12 years I've been around; I don't see how we're going
>>> > to start now. This would probably make utils DOA.
>>>
>>>
>>> Nit: this is presenting a false dichotomy, imho. NOT green means
>>> harder/headache but not "not usable/valuable". Green is not a dependency,
>>> and I don't think that should be presented as a reason to do less testing.
>>>
>>> Moving towards (3) should instead be based on what downstream testing do we
>>> need. If we agree that some set of unit, property and fuzz testing puts us
>>> in a safe place (and every downstream agrees) that should be enough to
>>> warrant the minimalisation fo what CI to run.
>>>
>>
>
