Congrats on the newborn. I am assuming others also have personal things going on!!
Also discussion thread is ongoing from April and not last 4 days. If enough people think it is rushed, we can always revote. On Wed, Sep 12, 2018 at 2:24 PM Joshua McKenzie <jmcken...@apache.org> wrote: > That was four days ago, and I have a newborn at home. Not a lot of time for > people to respond that have other things going on in life. :) > > On Wed, Sep 12, 2018 at 5:13 PM sankalp kohli <kohlisank...@gmail.com> > wrote: > > > If you think vote is being forced, why not reply to my email on another > > thread when I said we should vote? Why was the thread dead for months and > > someone comes back with a contribution and then people starts talking? > > > > I would have happily waited for few more days!! > > > > > > > > On Wed, Sep 12, 2018 at 2:09 PM Joshua McKenzie <jmcken...@apache.org> > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > It is important we make progress as we have been discussing this > since > > > > April!! > > > > > > > > > The discussion was making progress. Just because you want things to > > happen > > > faster is no reason to force an early vote. > > > > > > On Wed, Sep 12, 2018 at 5:04 PM sankalp kohli <kohlisank...@gmail.com> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > Also my vote is same as Jeff. d but would slightly prefer b. It is > > > > important we make progress as we have been discussing this since > > April!! > > > > > > > > On Wed, Sep 12, 2018 at 1:52 PM sankalp kohli < > kohlisank...@gmail.com> > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > The last email on the thread was 3 days ago and I made it clear > days > > > back > > > > > that we should vote on it to make progress. Without this vote, I am > > not > > > > > sure we will make progress. > > > > > Many people want to contribute on this and hence we are voting so > we > > > can > > > > > make progress. > > > > > > > > > > My vote is d > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Wed, Sep 12, 2018 at 1:36 PM Jonathan Haddad <j...@jonhaddad.com > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > >> This voting process feels a bit rushed and frankly not well > thought > > > out. > > > > >> In addition to Sylvain's valid points, which you (Sankalp) didn't > > > > address > > > > >> at all, the discussion in the other threads seemed to be ongoing. > > The > > > > >> last > > > > >> email you wrote on one of them was asking for additional feedback, > > > that > > > > >> indicates the discussion is still open. > > > > >> > > > > >> Out of principal I vote for none of the options (inaction). > You're > > > > >> deliberately trying to ram *something* through, and that's not how > > > this > > > > is > > > > >> supposed to work. > > > > >> > > > > >> For those of you unfamiliar with the process - please read > > > > >> https://www.apache.org/foundation/voting.html. > > > > >> > > > > >> I'd like to ask those of you that are +1'ing, are you willing to > > > > >> contribute > > > > >> or are you just voting we start an admin tool from scratch because > > you > > > > >> think it'll somehow produce a perfect codebase? > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> On Wed, Sep 12, 2018 at 12:50 PM sankalp kohli < > > > kohlisank...@gmail.com> > > > > >> wrote: > > > > >> > > > > >> > Hi Sylvain, > > > > >> > I would appreciate if we can give feedback on > the > > > > >> > discussion threads and not wait for vote threads. I made it > clear > > in > > > > the > > > > >> > discussion thread that we will start a vote!! > > > > >> > Thanks, > > > > >> > Sankalp > > > > >> > > > > > >> > On Wed, Sep 12, 2018 at 12:47 PM Jeff Jirsa <jji...@gmail.com> > > > wrote: > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > On Wed, Sep 12, 2018 at 12:41 PM Sylvain Lebresne < > > > > lebre...@gmail.com > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > wrote: > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > That's probably a stupid question, and excuse me if it is, > but > > > > what > > > > >> > does > > > > >> > > > those votes on the dev mailing list even mean? > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > How do you count votes at the end? Just by counting all > votes > > > > cast, > > > > >> > > > irregardless of whomever cast it? Or are we intending to > only > > > > count > > > > >> PMC > > > > >> > > > members, or maybe committers votes? > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > I believe the intent is to try to see if there exists > consensus. > > > > >> > > Ultimately, PMC is going to matter more than random email > > > addresses > > > > >> from > > > > >> > > people nobody recognizes. This should be in public, though, > not > > > > >> private, > > > > >> > so > > > > >> > > seeing what feedback is beyond the PMC is useful (primarily > > > because > > > > it > > > > >> > will > > > > >> > > matter when it comes time to extend and maintain it - if > people > > > > >> strongly > > > > >> > > prefer one or the other, then maintenance is going to be a > > > problem). > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > If there's 100 random non-contributor votes for one option and > > 20 > > > > pmc > > > > >> > votes > > > > >> > > for another options, I think the real answer will be "we don't > > > have > > > > >> > > consensus, and either we don't do it, or we do it the way the > > PMC > > > > >> thinks > > > > >> > is > > > > >> > > best", for all of the reasons you describe in the paragraphs > > > below. > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > If the former, that is a bit weird to me because we simply > > don't > > > > >> know > > > > >> > who > > > > >> > > > votes. And I don't mean to be rude towards anyone, but 1) > > > someone > > > > >> could > > > > >> > > > easily create 10 email addresses to vote 10 times (and sure, > > you > > > > >> could > > > > >> > > > invoke trust, and I'm not entirely against trust in general, > > but > > > > >> it's > > > > >> > the > > > > >> > > > internet...) and 2) this kind of decision will have > > non-trivial > > > > >> > > > consequences for the project, particularly on those that > > > maintain > > > > >> it, > > > > >> > so > > > > >> > > I > > > > >> > > > admit I'm not entirely comfortable with "anyone's voice has > > the > > > > same > > > > >> > > > weight". > > > > >> > > > If the latter, then this makes more sense to me (why are we > > even > > > > >> > > bothering > > > > >> > > > voting PMC members in if it's not to handle these kinds of > > > > >> decisions, > > > > >> > > which > > > > >> > > > are very "project management" related), but we should be > very > > > > clear > > > > >> > about > > > > >> > > > this from the get go (we could still use the dev list for > > > > >> transparency > > > > >> > > > sake, that I don't mind)? We should probably also have some > > > > >> deadline to > > > > >> > > the > > > > >> > > > vote, one that isn't too short. > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > Like releases, I think PMC votes count > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > Anyway, fwiw, my opinion on this vote is not far from the > one > > on > > > > the > > > > >> > > golang > > > > >> > > > driver acceptance vote (for which my remark above also apply > > > btw): > > > > >> no > > > > >> > yet > > > > >> > > > 100% convinced adding more pieces and scope to the project > is > > > what > > > > >> the > > > > >> > > > project needs just right now, but not strongly opposed if > > people > > > > >> really > > > > >> > > > wants this (and this one makes more sense to me than the > > golang > > > > >> driver > > > > >> > > > actually). But if I'm to pick between a) and b), I'm leaning > > b). > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > FWIW, two of the main reasons I'm in favor is as a way to > lower > > > > >> barrier > > > > >> > to > > > > >> > > entry to both using the software AND contributing to the > > project, > > > > so I > > > > >> > > think your points are valid (both on gocql thread and on this > > note > > > > >> > above), > > > > >> > > but I think that's also part of why we should be encouraging > > both. > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > - Jeff > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> -- > > > > >> Jon Haddad > > > > >> http://www.rustyrazorblade.com > > > > >> twitter: rustyrazorblade > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
