Hi Andrei, thank you for posting on this very important topic.
I want to share my experience and view hoping that you draw some useful conclusions and we can keep i386 in some way available. Andrei POPESCU wrote: [snip] > > My intuition is also that i386, although becoming less popular, was > starting from such a huge install base that the resources are probably out > there somewhere. > >> Further, unless "sudden death of most porters" can be added to the list >> of bad events of 2020, I feel confident in saying that there are still >> probably some more people who simply haven't gotten around to confirming >> that they can be a porter. > > I agree. Most of my point is just that they should do that. :) Now's > the time. > My use of i386 is on a geode based Accrosser industrial PC that is used as FW and VPN. The issue with this hardware is that the debian stock kernel never worked and I spent a lot of time finding the proper combination of legacy IDE driver configuration, so that it can boot from a CF card. In this context the ability to test debian kernel is not present. I have a second device (with less RAM) as a spare that can be freely used for testing. >> While I agree that i386 kernel support should be phased out, and might >> even need to be dropped altogether, I strongly disagree with the >> original premise of this thread, that all i386 support should be dropped >> for Bullseye. > > I may be able to reassure you a bit there. Someone pointing out that we > don't have enough confirmed resources for a port happens semi-regularly, > and the usual outcome is that enough resources step forward. We're not > very eager to drop things that people want to support. The point is to > prod people into stepping forward and volunteering for the things they > care about. > > What's perhaps more significant is that i386 is now getting to the point > where it requires such prodding, instead of being an assumed default > architecture. That means that the folks who care about it should probably > start thinking about building more organization and structure around the > work, recruiting people, building a task list, and so forth, instead of > just assuming "oh, everything will work on i386, it always has." > Volunteering to do that sort of coordination is helpful even if you aren't > debugging FTBFS problems. Is it feasible to have the base system working as a priority, so that i386 is still available? The applications might be stripped down and people who are affected should take action to test and get involved. On my side I can offer conducting tests on the spare device - even more if it can be automated in some way as I really do not have much time for big tasks. I was thinking of creating a local repository of the sources of the packages I use and setup a build process, so that I can still update in future and keep the system running. I really do not see why I should spent money on new hardware - the advantages in my use case are not big doing so. For example I payed for the Accrosser Geode devices about 250,- (US$) each. Newer devices I looked last year and couple of months ago are >400. Here is the list and except kernel all is debian stock. Of course I can install more but the device is not a Porsche (500MHz with 128MB RAM) :) It doesn't consume much power though - contrary to one i386 notebook that is perfectly working, but I do not want to keep all the time powered on. # dpkg --get-selections acl install acpi install acpitool install adduser install apt install apt-utils install at install base-files install base-passwd install bash install bc install binutils install binutils-common:i386 install binutils-i686-linux-gnu install borgbackup install bsd-mailx install bsdmainutils install bsdutils install busybox install bzip2 install ca-certificates install chkrootkit install console-common install console-data install coreutils install cpio install cron install dash install debconf install debconf-i18n install debconf-utils install debian-archive-keyring install debianutils install diffutils install dirmngr install dmsetup install dpkg install dselect install e2fslibs:i386 install e2fsprogs install e2fsprogs-l10n install easy-rsa install ed install ethtool install fdisk install file install findutils install fuse install gcc-8-base:i386 install gettext-base install gnupg install gnupg-agent install gnupg-l10n install gnupg-utils install gnutls-bin install gpg install gpg-agent install gpg-wks-client install gpg-wks-server install gpgconf install gpgsm install gpgv install grep install groff-base install grub-common install grub-legacy install grub-pc-bin install gzip install hostname install ifupdown install inetutils-syslogd install init install init-system-helpers install initramfs-tools install initramfs-tools-core install initscripts install insserv install iperf install iproute2 install iptables install iptraf install iptraf-ng install iputils-ping install isc-dhcp-client install isc-dhcp-common install kbd install keychain install klibc-utils install kmod install libacl1:i386 install libapt-inst2.0:i386 install libapt-pkg5.0:i386 install libassuan0:i386 install libatm1:i386 install libattr1:i386 install libaudit-common install libaudit1:i386 install libb2-1 install libbinutils:i386 install libblkid1:i386 install libbsd0:i386 install libbz2-1.0:i386 install libc-bin install libc-l10n install libc6:i386 install libcap-ng0:i386 install libcap2:i386 install libcap2-bin install libclass-isa-perl install libcom-err2:i386 install libcomerr2:i386 install libdaemon0:i386 install libdb5.3:i386 install libdbus-1-3:i386 install libdbus-glib-1-2:i386 install libdebconfclient0:i386 install libdevmapper1.02.1:i386 install libdns-export1104 install libedit2:i386 install libefiboot1:i386 install libefivar1:i386 install libelf1:i386 install libevent-2.1-6:i386 install libexpat1:i386 install libext2fs2:i386 install libfdisk1:i386 install libffi6:i386 install libfl2:i386 install libfreetype6:i386 install libfuse2:i386 install libgcc1:i386 install libgcrypt20:i386 install libgdbm-compat4:i386 install libgdbm6:i386 install libglib2.0-0:i386 install libgmp10:i386 install libgnutls-dane0:i386 install libgnutls30:i386 install libgomp1:i386 install libgpg-error-l10n install libgpg-error0:i386 install libgpm2:i386 install libgssapi-krb5-2:i386 install libgssglue1:i386 install libhogweed4:i386 install libicu63:i386 install libidn11:i386 install libidn2-0:i386 install libip4tc0:i386 install libip6tc0:i386 install libiptc0:i386 install libisc-export1100:i386 install libjansson4:i386 install libk5crypto3:i386 install libkeyutils1:i386 install libklibc:i386 install libkmod2:i386 install libkrb5-3:i386 install libkrb5support0:i386 install libksba8:i386 install libldap-2.4-2:i386 install libldap-common install liblocale-gettext-perl install liblockfile-bin install liblockfile1:i386 install liblz4-1:i386 install liblzma5:i386 install liblzo2-2:i386 install libmagic-mgc install libmagic1:i386 install libmnl0:i386 install libmount1:i386 install libmpdec2:i386 install libncurses5:i386 install libncurses6:i386 install libncursesw5:i386 install libncursesw6:i386 install libnetfilter-conntrack3:i386 install libnetfilter-cthelper0:i386 install libnettle6:i386 install libnfnetlink0:i386 install libnfsidmap2:i386 install libnftables0:i386 install libnftnl11:i386 install libnpth0:i386 install libopts25:i386 install libp11-kit0:i386 install libpam-cap:i386 install libpam-modules:i386 install libpam-modules-bin install libpam-runtime install libpam-ssh install libpam-tmpdir install libpam0g:i386 install libpcap0.8:i386 install libpci3:i386 install libpcre3:i386 install libperl5.28:i386 install libpkcs11-helper1:i386 install libpng16-16:i386 install libpolkit-gobject-1-0:i386 install libpopt0:i386 install libprocps7:i386 install libpython-stdlib:i386 install libpython2-stdlib:i386 install libpython2.7-minimal:i386 install libpython2.7-stdlib:i386 install libpython3-stdlib:i386 install libpython3.7-minimal:i386 install libpython3.7-stdlib:i386 install libreadline7:i386 install libsasl2-2:i386 install libsasl2-modules:i386 install libsasl2-modules-db:i386 install libseccomp2:i386 install libselinux1:i386 install libsemanage-common install libsemanage1:i386 install libsepol1:i386 install libslang2:i386 install libsmartcols1:i386 install libsqlite3-0:i386 install libss2:i386 install libssl1.1:i386 install libstdc++5:i386 install libstdc++6:i386 install libswitch-perl install libsystemd0:i386 install libtasn1-6:i386 install libtext-charwidth-perl install libtext-iconv-perl install libtext-wrapi18n-perl install libtinfo5:i386 install libtinfo6:i386 install libuchardet0:i386 install libudev1:i386 install libunbound8:i386 install libunicode-string-perl install libunistring2:i386 install libusb-0.1-4:i386 install libustr-1.0-1:i386 install libuuid1:i386 install libwrap0:i386 install libxtables12:i386 install libzstd1:i386 install linux-base install linux-image-4.19.25gx2 install linux-image-4.19.25gx2-deb10 install locales install login install logrotate install lrzsz install lsb-base install lzma install make install makedev install mawk install mbr install menu install mime-support install mingetty install minicom install mount install multiarch-support install ncurses-base install ncurses-bin install ncurses-term install ne install ne-doc install net-tools install netbase install nftables install ntpdate install nvi install openssh-client install openssh-server install openssh-sftp-server install openssl install openvpn install passwd install pciutils install perl install perl-base install perl-modules-5.28 install pigz install pinentry-curses install postfix install postfix-sqlite install procps install psmisc install python install python-minimal install python2 install python2-minimal install python2.7 install python2.7-minimal install python3 install python3-llfuse install python3-minimal install python3-msgpack install python3-pkg-resources install python3.7 install python3.7-minimal install readline-common install resolvconf install sed install sensible-utils install shorewall install shorewall-core install ssh install ssl-cert install startpar install sudo install sysv-rc install sysvinit-core install sysvinit-utils install tar install tcpdump install traceroute install tzdata install ucf install udev install unzip install util-linux install xz-utils install zip install zlib1g:i386 install
