Bob Proulx wrote: > Joel Roth wrote: > > Bob Proulx wrote: > > > Joel Roth wrote: > > > > I'm just so used to the dependencies being taken > > > > care of by APT, that I was surprised to have to > > > > lift my little pinkie. > > > > > > Uhm... An 'apt-get upgrade' should have offered those for upgrade. > > > They do for me. They didn't for you? Perhaps you have pinning or > > > other preventatives in place? Please say more! > > > > Ah, I didn't even think to try an apt-get upgrade. > > !!?? Shock! Surprise! It is the *first* thing I think of to try to > fix something.
Well, it's a credit to Debian and software in general that I've coasted along. > > I usually just upgrade apps individually as I need to... > > As in 'apt-get install openssh-client' ? But that won't upgrade any > of the dependencies. I didn't know that. My first try was apt-get install ssh. Hmmm, and we don't have apt-get --update-dependencies install ssh, I see that I'm 1,680 packages behind... > > an attitude based on (possibly) outdated fears of > > getting stuck in between upgrades of C libraries > > or other large-scale brokenness. > > As others commented (but I wanted to directly address this) you > shouldn't have this worry like this. And actually not getting > upgrades in a timely manor is a worse problem. > > On Sid/Unstable I upgrade daily with: > > # apt-get update > # apt-get upgrade > # apt-get dist-upgrade > > The first sync's the Packages files, the index of what is current. > Then the 'upgrade' is a very restricted upgrade that only upgrades > packages in place. It cannot pull in any new packages such as when a > package is split or when a package gains new dependencies. But most > important it cannot remove packages. > > Then 'dist-upgrade' and I look at the screen for dist-upgrade very > carefully. I cannot stress this enough. Look at that very carefully. > Most important is to check to see if any packages are going to be > removed. If a bind9 update wants to install new liblwres80 that is > okay. But if a netcf upgrade wants to remove kvm (Bug#694362 for > example) then do not do it! > > Examine the problem and apply "hold" to dpkg as needed to whatever > packages are appropriate 'apt-mark hold pkg' is a convenient frontend > to 'echo pkg hold | dpkg --set-selections'. After holding try the > dist-upgrade again. Repeat as needed until the result is > satisfactory. If this is needed then file a bug report. > > I do this every day. Because the changes from one day to the next day > are small enough that I can work through them and recognize them as > they occur. If I were to wait six months then the amount of thrash in > Sid/Unstable would make recognizing and reducing these problems much > more difficult. > > Also a Sid/Unstable upgrade that was from a year ago to today may need > special handling that was already taken care of in other ways. In a > day to day transition everything will be current and rolling. But > after a long time people forget and the upgrade may be broken in ways > that don't matter to anyone else and therefore will never get fixed. > Remember that only major release points such as Squeeze and Wheezy are > extensively tested across long times and large changes. Major > releases will work, within the documented procedures from the upgrade > notes. But what amounts to a similar major upgrade between Sid-2011 > and Sid-2012 won't be tested at all. You are on your own. > > > an attitude based on (possibly) outdated fears of > > getting stuck in between upgrades of C libraries > > or other large-scale brokenness. The resolution of more complicated dependency issues, has improved a lot, in my subjective opinion. Let's see how my current upgrade goes.... Some 1300 were packaged installed by 'upgrade' another 340 packages installed by 'dist-upgrade'. There were minor hiccups. In both cases errors were reported, and in both cases an extra apt-get install completed the process. I don't know when the last upgrade took place, next one will be sooner, I'm sure. > In summary if running Sid/Unstable or Testing too then I think it is > best to keep current and not let the parts get too old and stale. It > is just easier that way. "In for a penny, in for a pound." Your descriptions of the upgrade procedure and how to review it and hold packages could be a useful reference for users of testing or unstable. Joel > > Thanks for your comment. This list/community is a great support. > > It seriously is one of the best things! > > Bob -- Joel Roth -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-requ...@lists.debian.org with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmas...@lists.debian.org Archive: http://lists.debian.org/20121227005313.GA24616@sprite
