They definitely must fear AMD to be faster, with good reasons.
Let's check things.
Past 12 years that i been watching reports on new cpu's intels
performance of new great cpu's
always got leaked out long before.
All we have now is some posting of a guy from which i cannot confirm
he been honest, in face he could've
made it all up, as i do not know the guy:
by: Vael Jean-Paul
Joined: 24 Apr 2008
Posts: 28
subject: Nehalem 8threads running Toga 1.4.2JD-8cpu
Posted: Fri Jun 27, 2008 6:04 pm Reply to topic Reply with quote
Here you can see TogaII 1.4.2JD-8cpu running on the new Nehalem at
3Ghz! stock speed.
I let him just calculate from the begin position...and compare it
with your computer how many nodes you get!
With my computer a Q6600 at 3.2Ghz i have 4.4Million/nodes and the
Nehalem gives 5.8Million/nodes!! So it will be a nice speed gain again!
http://img413.imageshack.us/img413/8333/nehalembi4.jpg
JP.
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---
Now i downloaded that executable.
Then i ran it on my old dual opteron dual core 2.4Ghz opteron machine
with PC2100 RAM.
Please note that this old RAM is a big bottleneck for a fast program
like Toga, Toga initially
was Fruit source code with 50 lines modified. They parallellized it a
tad for shared memory machines.
Fruit,Toga author = Fabien Letouzey (France)
1/01 0:00 +0.06 1.Na3 (2)
1/01 0:00 +0.34 1.Nc3 (3)
1/01 0:00 +0.40 1.d4 (13)
2/02 0:00 +0.20 1.d4 d5 (45)
3/07 0:00 +0.34 1.d4 d5 2.Nf3 (182)
4/10 0:00 +0.20 1.d4 d5 2.Nf3 Nf6 (537)
5/12 0:00 +0.30 1.d4 d5 2.Nf3 Nf6 3.Nc3 (2.370)
6/12 0:00 +0.20 1.d4 d5 2.Nf3 Nf6 3.Nc3 Nc6 (4.646)
7/14 0:00 +0.20 1.d4 d5 2.Nf3 Nf6 3.Nc3 Nc6 4.Bf4 (11.682)
8/14 0:00 +0.20 1.d4 d5 2.Nf3 Nf6 3.Nc3 Nc6 4.Bf4 Bf5 (23.561)
9/19 0:00 +0.16 1.d4 Nf6 2.Nc3 d5 3.Bf4 Nh5 4.Be5 Nc6 5.Nf3
Nxe5 6.Nxe5 (54.951)
10/20 0:00 +0.23 1.d4 Nf6 2.Nc3 d5 3.Nf3 Qd6 4.Bd2 Nc6 (38.442)
10/21 0:00 +0.25 1.d4 Nf6 2.Nc3 d5 3.Nf3 Nc6 4.Bf4 e6 5.e3 (46.374)
10/20 0:00 +0.26 1.Nc3 d5 2.d4 Nf6 3.Nf3 Nc6 4.Bf4 Bf5 5.Nb5 Rc8
(99.448)
11/21 0:00 +0.13 1.d4 Nf6 2.Nc3 d5 3.Nf3 Nc6 4.Qd3 Bd7 5.a3 Bg4
6.Bf4 (105.957)
11/24 0:00 +0.16 1.Nc3 Nf6 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.e4 d5 4.exd5 Nxd5 5.Bb5
Nxc3 6.bxc3 Qd5 7.Qe2 (104.602)
12/23 0:00 +0.13 1.Nc3 Nf6 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.e4 d5 4.exd5 Nxd5 5.Nxd5
Qxd5 6.Be2 Bf5 7.O-O e5 (192.446)
12/24 0:00 +0.18 1.d4 Nf6 2.Nf3 d5 3.c4 e6 4.cxd5 exd5 5.Nc3 Bb4
6.Qa4+ Nc6 7.Ne5 Bxc3+ 8.bxc3 O-O 9.Nxc6 bxc6 10.Qxc6 (403.232)
12/25 0:00 +0.20 1.Nf3 Nf6 2.e3 Nc6 3.d4 e6 4.Nc3 d5 5.Bb5 Bb4
6.O-O O-O (442.776)
13/30 0:01 +0.15 1.Nf3 Nf6 2.d4 e6 3.e3 d5 4.Bb5+ Bd7 5.Nc3 Bb4
6.Bd3 Nc6 7.O-O O-O (1.088.947) 2958
13/30 0:01 +0.26 1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nf6 3.Nxe5 Qe7 4.d4 d6 5.Nf3 Qxe4
+ 6.Be2 d5 7.O-O Bb4 (1.203.253) 2958
13/30 0:01 +0.28 1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nf6 3.Nxe5 d6 4.Nc4 Nxe4 5.Qe2 d5
6.Nc3 b5 7.Nxe4 bxc4 (1.227.804) 2958
14/34 0:03 +0.26 1.e4 Nf6 2.e5 Nd5 3.Nf3 Nc6 4.Bb5 e6 5.O-O Be7
6.Nc3 Nxc3 7.dxc3 O-O 8.Be3 (2.581.722) 3129
14/33 0:03 +0.34 1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nf6 3.Nxe5 d6 4.Nf3 Nxe4 5.Bb5+
c6 6.Be2 Be7 7.d3 Nf6 8.O-O O-O 9.Nc3 (2.553.907) 3129
15/33 0:05 +0.35 1.e4 d5 2.exd5 Nf6 3.Nf3 Nxd5 4.d4 e6 5.Bd3 Nc6
6.O-O Be7 7.Nc3 O-O 8.Re1 Re8 9.Nxd5 exd5 (4.762.459) 3195
15/34 0:05 +0.36 1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nf6 3.Nxe5 d6 4.Nf3 Nxe4 5.Bb5+
c6 6.Be2 Be7 7.d3 Nf6 8.O-O O-O 9.Nc3 Be6 (4.809.423) 3195
16/35 0:09 +0.32 1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nf6 3.Nxe5 d6 4.Nf3 Nxe4 5.d3 Nf6
6.d4 Be7 7.Nc3 O-O 8.Bd3 Nc6 9.O-O Be6 (7.746.606) 3317
17/37 0:19 +0.36 1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nf6 3.Nxe5 d6 4.Nf3 Nxe4 5.Bd3
Nf6 6.b3 Qe7+ 7.Be2 Nc6 8.O-O Bf5 9.d4 O-O-O 10.Nc3 (17.138.797) 3481
18/45 0:40 +0.27 1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nf6 3.Nxe5 d6 4.Nf3 Nxe4 5.Bd3
Nf6 6.O-O Nc6 7.b3 Be7 8.Ba3 O-O 9.Re1 Nd5 10.Nc3 Nxc3 11.dxc3
(37.171.149) 3660
19/45 1:12 +0.26 1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nf6 3.Nxe5 d6 4.Nf3 Nxe4 5.Qe2
Qe7 6.Nc3 Nxc3 7.dxc3 Nc6 8.Be3 Be6 9.O-O-O O-O-O 10.Qb5 a6 11.Qa4 d5
(66.063.998) 3654
20/45 2:58 +0.20 1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nf6 3.Nxe5 d6 4.Nd3 Nxe4 5.Qe2
Qe7 6.Nf4 Nc6 7.Nd5 Nd4 8.Nxe7 Nxe2 9.Nd5 c6 10.Bxe2 cxd5 11.Nc3 Be6
12.Bb5+ Ke7 (153.338.164) 3596
20/43 2:59 +0.33 1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nf6 3.Nxe5 d6 4.Nd3 Nxe4 5.Qe2
Qe7 6.Nf4 Nc6 7.Nd5 Nd4 8.Nxe7 Nxe2 9.Nd5 c6 10.Bxe2 cxd5 11.d3 Nc5
12.Nc3 (144.181.758) 3596
21/48 5:48 +0.21 1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nf6 3.Nxe5 d6 4.Nf3 Nxe4 5.Qe2
Qe7 6.Nc3 Nxc3 7.dxc3 Nc6 8.Bf4 a5 9.Nd4 Nxd4 10.cxd4 Bg4 11.f3 Be6
(315.235.900) 3617
21/48 5:48 +0.22 1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nf6 3.Nxe5 d6 4.Nf3 Nxe4 5.d3 Nf6
6.d4 Nc6 7.Nc3 d5 8.Bb5 Bb4 9.Qe2+ Qe7 10.Bg5 Bxc3+ 11.bxc3 Qxe2+
12.Kxe2 Ne4 13.c4 Nc3+ 14.Kd3 (313.098.050) 3617
22/48 12:51 +0.18 1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nf6 3.Nxe5 d6 4.Nf3 Nxe4 5.Qe2
Qe7 6.Nc3 Nxc3 7.dxc3 Nc6 8.Bf4 Qxe2+ 9.Bxe2 Be7 10.O-O-O O-O 11.Rhe1
Be6 12.Kb1 Rfe8 13.Ng5 Bf5 14.Rd5 (715.698.771) 3708
22/48 12:53 +0.20 1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nf6 3.Nxe5 d6 4.Nf3 Nxe4 5.Qe2
Qe7 6.Nc3 Nxc3 7.dxc3 Nc6 8.Bf4 Qxe2+ 9.Bxe2 Be7 10.O-O-O O-O 11.Rhe1
Be6 12.Kb1 Rfe8 13.Ng5 Bf5 (642.733.687) 3708
22/50 14:30 +0.22 1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nf6 3.Nxe5 d6 4.Nf3 Nxe4 5.Qe2
Qe7 6.Nc3 Nxc3 7.dxc3 Nc6 8.Bf4 Qxe2+ 9.Bxe2 Be7 10.O-O Bd7 11.Rfe1 O-
O 12.Bb5 Rfe8 13.Rad1 Bf6 (695.660.943) 3697
23/55 29:51 +0.22 1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nf6 3.Nxe5 d6 4.Nf3 Nxe4 5.Qe2
Qe7 6.Nc3 Nxc3 7.dxc3 Qxe2+ 8.Bxe2 Nc6 9.Bf4 Be7 10.O-O-O O-O 11.Rhe1
Re8 12.Rd5 Bf6 13.h3 Bd7 (1.667.029.770) 3722
23/52 40:30 +0.23 1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nf6 3.Nxe5 d6 4.Nf3 Nxe4 5.Qe2
Qe7 6.d3 Nf6 7.Nc3 Nc6 8.Bg5 Qxe2+ 9.Bxe2 Be7 10.Nb5 Kd8 11.O-O h6
12.Be3 Nd5 13.Nfd4 Nxe3 14.fxe3 (2.039.956.804) 3699
23/58 45:41 +0.28 1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nf6 3.Nxe5 d6 4.Nf3 Nxe4 5.Qe2
Qe7 6.d3 Nf6 7.Nc3 Nc6 8.Bg5 Qxe2+ 9.Bxe2 Be7 10.Nb5 Kd8 11.O-O Nb4
12.Nbd4 Bg4 13.Rfe1 (2.535.957.352) 3697
24/59 72:43 +0.20 1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nf6 3.Nxe5 d6 4.Nf3 Nxe4 5.Qe2
Qe7 6.d3 Nf6 7.Nc3 Nc6 8.Bg5 Qxe2+ 9.Bxe2 Be7 10.Nb5 Kd8 11.Bd2 Bg4
12.Ng5 Ne5 13.d4 Bxe2 14.Kxe2 (4.123.340.979) 3780
24/56 73:16 +0.27 1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nf6 3.Nxe5 d6 4.Nf3 Nxe4 5.Qe2
Qe7 6.d3 Nf6 7.Nc3 Nc6 8.Bg5 Qxe2+ 9.Bxe2 Bd7 10.d4 Be7 11.O-O-O O-O
12.d5 Ne5 13.Nxe5 dxe5 14.Nb5 (3.764.072.477) 3777
24/58 73:58 +0.31 1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nf6 3.Nxe5 d6 4.Nf3 Nxe4 5.Qe2
Qe7 6.d3 Nf6 7.Nc3 Nc6 8.Bg5 Qxe2+ 9.Bxe2 Bd7 10.d4 Be7 11.O-O-O Ng4
12.Rde1 Nxf2 13.Rhf1 Ng4 14.Nd5 (4.123.413.325) 3775
I assumed 128MB hashtable, which is the default. I do not know other
settings used on Nehalem so i can only gamble them.
Weird is that the nps on nehalem peaks after 16 ply already, so
within seconds. That is very weird. Means probably tiny hashtable
been used.
A program like Toga is not a good program to test on Nehalem with 8
logical cores.
But here is extrapolation to 3Ghz of my machine. Again i have PC2100
registered RAM inside this S2881 mainboard.
That really sucks.
if i extrapolate opteron from 2.4Ghz to 3Ghz that would mean at 22 ply:
Nehalem 8 cores : 5.8 mln
opteron 3Ghz PC2100 ==> 1.25 * 3.708 = 4.635
5.8 / 4.635 = 1.25
In short the move from PC2100 to on die memory controller DDR3 that
should give a memory latency hungry program like Toga
already 25%. Then we've got hyperthreading that will bring also a
limited speed increase.
All this together gives just 25%, very little IMHO.
From Phenom i know integers do not run faster on it, but with DDR2
it is a lot faster than this PC2100 i've got.
I conclude for my chessprogram Diep, a 4 core AMD might be faster
than 8 cores Nehalem.
that said, it is possible that the program Toga is bad for 8 cores
and that my Diep is doing much better at it.
Those guys are not so good in parallellizing software. Alfabeta is
hard to parallellize very efficient.
The above calculation could be wrong therefore when benchmarking Diep
at it.
Vincent
On Oct 15, 2008, at 3:06 PM, Prentice Bisbal wrote:
Joe Landman wrote:
Do you, by any chance, have any substantial performance figure to
make
us drool? :)
Intel has asked that no benchmarks be published by people with units.
Sounds like Intel has something to hide.
--
Prentice
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